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All Android users were or are wondering whether flashing their device will void the warranties of their devices.
This concerns European customers (EU).
In short :
The FSFE (Free Software Foundation Europe), has concluded that rooting and flashing our devices don't void their warranties. Manufacturers can't refuse to repair a device because modifying or changing system software is not a sufficient reason to void the "statutory warranty". The seller has to prove that the defect is caused by user's actions before completelly voiding the warranty. Unless that, the standard 2 years of the warranty is still valid. So the Directive 1999/44/CE dictates1 protects consummers even if they have rooted and flashed their system in order to use custom ROMs.
FSFE Legal team has analysed this issue and the answer, if the consumer bought it inside the EU, is no.
The consumer does not loose the obligatory 2-year warranty on the device just because the device is flashed.
"A good test to see if it is the software’s fault is to flash it back with stock firmware/OS and see if the problem persists. If it does, it is not a software-caused problem. If it is not possible to revert it to stock software any more, it is also not a software-caused defect. There are very few hardware defects that are caused by software".
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Full article :
Directive 1999/44/CE dictates1 that any object meeting certain criteria (incl. telephones, computers, routers etc.) that is sold to a consumer2. inside the European Union, has to carry a warranty from the seller that the device will meet the quality that you would expect for such a device for a period of 2 years.
A telephone is an example of such a device and is an object that comprises many parts, from the case to the screen to the radio, to a mini-computer, to the battery, to the software that runs it. If any of these parts3 stop working in those 2 years, the seller has to fix or replace them. What is more these repairs should not cost the consumer a single cent — the seller has to cover the expenses (Directive 1999/44/CE, §3). If the seller has any expenses for returning it to the manufacturer, this is not your problem as a consumer.
If your device becomes defective in the first 6 months, it is presumed that the defect was there all along, so you should not need to prove anything.
If your device becomes defective after the first 6 months, but before 2 years run out, you are still covered. The difference is only that if the defect arises now, the seller can claim that the defect was caused by some action that was triggered by non-normal use of the device4. But in order to avoid needing to repair or replace your device, the seller has to prove that your action caused5 the defect. It is generally recognised by courts that unless there is a sign of abuse of the device, the defect is there because the device was faulty from the beginning. That is just common sense, after all.
So, we finally come to the question of rooting, flashing and changing the software. Unless the seller can prove that modifying the software, rooting your device or flashing it with some other OS or firmware was the cause for the defect, you are still covered for defects during those 2 years. A good test to see if it is the software’s fault is to flash it back with stock firmware/OS and see if the problem persists. If it does, it is not a software-caused problem. If it is not possible to revert it stock software any more, it is also not a software-caused defect. There are very few hardware defects that are caused by software — e.g. overriding the speaker volume above the safe level could blow the speaker.
Many manufacturers of consumer devices write into their warranties a paragraph that by changing the software or “rooting” your device, you void the warranty. You have to understand that in EU we have a “statutory warranty”, which is compulsory that the seller must offer by law (Directive 1999/44/CE, §7.1) and a “voluntary warranty” which the seller or manufacturer can, but does not need to, offer as an additional service to the consumer. Usually the “voluntary warranty” covers a longer period of time or additional accidents not covered by law6. If though the seller, the manufacturer or anyone else offers a “voluntary warranty”, he is bound to it as well!
So, even if, by any chance your “voluntary warranty” got voided, by European law, you should still have the 2 year “compulsory warranty” as it is described in the Directive and which is the topic of this article.
In case the seller refuses your right to repair or replace the device, you can sue him in a civil litigation and can report the incident to the national authority. In many European countries such action does not even require hiring a lawyer and is most of the time ensured by consumers associations.
The warranty under this Directive is only applicable inside the European Union and only if you bought the device as a consumer.
[1] EU member states must have by now imported the Directive 1999/44/CE into their national laws. So you should quote also your local law on that topic.
[2] A consumer is a natural person who acts for their own private purposes and not as a professional. .
[3] Batteries can be exempt of this and usually hold only 6 months warranty.
[4] E.g. a defect power button could be caused by spreading marmalade in it or hooking it onto a robot that would continuously press the button every second 24/7 — of course that is not normal or intended use.
[5] Note that correlation is not causation — the defect has to be proven to be caused by your action, not just correlate with it.
[6] E.g. if a device manufacturer guarantees the phone is water- and shock-proof or a car manufacturer offers 7 years of warranty against rust.
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Source, article
Reference : EUR-Lex
Thank you, good info.
So if they refuse, should I print this and give it to them?
To be safe, I flashed and rooted it after my warranty expired.
It'll take time for LG to honour the warranty worldwide.
Welcome locked bootloaders.
In Italy LG warranty doesn't get voided by rooting and custom Rom installation.
I don't know why in other countries it's not the same...
Anyway thank you for sharing this information!
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda app-developers app
Navios92 said:
So if they refuse, should I print this and give it to them?
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yeah you might print the directive itself
the bad side of all of that, is that this situation only applies in Europe for now. I live in France, here the consummers are well protected already. For other countries, you can refer to UE and its related laws.
Visit EUR-Lex for more infos
Many thanks for this :victory:
Cool
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda app-developers app
Francais ? Nikel.
It's so good to read this. Every time i visit LG C. I Flash Official Rom..
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda premium
thank's for your info my bro, matur nuwun sanget
Anyway we can always unroot, I did this when I asked for screen replacement.
The problem would be with people who bricked their USB and can't unroot.
Technically it's also not allowed to lock the bootloader without giving a way of unlocking it since it restrict the software that the user can use on his phone, but theres still lots of phones with locked bootloaders with no way of unlocking it.
Also it's really easy to tell someone bringing their phone into repair that their phone is broken because they did something while having root permissions if the person involved doesn't know electronics so well. It's still a step in a better direction.
I have question from starter!
If i instal some custom rom with overclocked cpu?
And this,just for euro?
And asia?
Sent from my LG-P970 using Tapatalk 2
Night.Sky said:
I have question from starter!
And this,just for euro?
And asia?
Sent from my LG-P970 using Tapatalk 2
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I'm not sure, but if you can send your device in a center located inside EU, it might pass. But since these laws concern european customers, I don't think so...
If i instal some custom rom with overclocked cpu?
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The seller has to prove that the defect is caused by user's actions...
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Great info! Thanks for that.
Not so sure
Not entirely sure this is something to cheer too much about.
It´s nice and all but we know flashing the wrong firmware can brick your phone. I´m not sure manufacturers should be responsible for that and this might encourage them to make it really tough to root the things in the first place.
ScoopyDoopy said:
Not entirely sure this is something to cheer too much about.
It´s nice and all but we know flashing the wrong firmware can brick your phone. I´m not sure manufacturers should be responsible for that and this might encourage them to make it really tough to root the things in the first place.
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flashing is not forbidden, but it's not about that. if a flash process fails, you can consider that fact as a defect since this may be a hardware issue (even if it's software, it should not happen).
it's like formatting a hard disk drive that would fail. so yeah, the manufacturer is responsible and must apply the warranty.
Ilko said:
flashing is not forbidden, but it's not about that. if a flash process fails, you can consider that fact as a defect since this may be a hardware issue (even if it's software, it should not happen).
it's like formatting a hard disk drive that would fail. so yeah, the manufacturer is responsible and must apply the warranty.
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Flashing wrong firmware can damage the phone. If the bootloader tries to initialize the phone with a higher voltage or clock and it stops somewhere in the process it stays with that clock speed and voltage until the phone is switched off again provided it doesn't crash before setting clock and voltages.
If it failed because of hardware then doesn't matter what software you had on it. Then your right, but wrong firmware can damage your phone. Remember the tools thats used for flashing isn't meant for us, it's for software developers or service centers and we shouldn't have access to it. The tools that are meant for us can't flash wrong firmware without there being wrong firmware on it in the first place so if you flash the wrong firmware then it's your fault and thats not hard to prove that theres wrong firmware on it or that the CPU was damaged due to wrong clock or voltage.
Yes this will lead to manufacturers making it harder to root and flash or they will (like HTC) allow unlocking the bootloader through them and explicitly voiding your warranty.
They can have a license agreement when the firmware is run fresh that you have to accept. Which might contain this sneaky line somewhere in small print.
"Running any software on the device that we don't approve voids your warrenty." (And I'm pretty sure that will include rooting software)
xonar_ said:
Flashing wrong firmware can damage the phone. If the bootloader tries to initialize the phone with a higher voltage or clock and it stops somewhere in the process it stays with that clock speed and voltage until the phone is switched off again provided it doesn't crash before setting clock and voltages.
If it failed because of hardware then doesn't matter what software you had on it. Then your right, but wrong firmware can damage your phone. Remember the tools thats used for flashing isn't meant for us, it's for software developers or service centers and we shouldn't have access to it. The tools that are meant for us can't flash wrong firmware without there being wrong firmware on it in the first place so if you flash the wrong firmware then it's your fault and thats not hard to prove that theres wrong firmware on it or that the CPU was damaged due to wrong clock or voltage.
Yes this will lead to manufacturers making it harder to root and flash or they will (like HTC) allow unlocking the bootloader through them and explicitly voiding your warranty.
They can have a license agreement when the firmware is run fresh that you have to accept. Which might contain this sneaky line somewhere in small print.
"Running any software on the device that we don't approve voids your warrenty." (And I'm pretty sure that will include rooting software)
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yes, but if such programs are leaked, it's their problem, not ours. there is no any law or rule that explicitly forbid software modification. It's open source... and the european directive protects us. I'll even say, that the ability of flashing wrong firmware could be considered as a default. This should not be possible.
people must understand that rooting and flashing are only restricted, not forbidden. I think they simply can't do that legally.
I bought a HTC One on April.
I am a student so this is important to me:
Cost: 660€ with urBeats headset. Paid 60€ and then I must pay 25€ each month for 2 years. Also 20€ per month for 2 years for Internet + unlimited calls in germany -> 45€/month
K.
On May I unlocked Bootloader. Then put a recovery. Then flashed a custom ROM.
I didn't like it so I flashed the original ROM back within 1-2 days
Ok.
Then 1 week ago the ONE died. It had original ROM on it and ofc unrooted.
Today they phoned me. Due to custom ROMS: No warranty.
I can pay 30€ to get the phone back unrepaired or they suggest me a amount of € I must pay to repair. This suggestion should be at my home in 1-2 days.
Nice eh? Never HTC for me.. No warranty with original ROM, yay!
where did you send it in for repair?
it is right that HTC behaves very rude if it comes to such topics, honestly i would have discussed with them, that in german law they have the need to proof that your custom rom/kernel... damaged the phone a way it would void the warranty (that is also the reason the HTC disclaimer has to say, that unlocking MAY void the warranty ...)
but in germany i never would send a phone to the manufacturer because the shop itself has to deliver a 2 year warranty. for example @ t-mobile store they remove all that can be removed (back cover, sd card if existant), send it in for repair and 24 hours later you already get your spare phone, your phone will not get analyzed until you try to switch it the third time, then they will make a test certificate.
Or did you really send it to O² and they said this to you? then i really would discuss this with the hotline and threaten them that you will change the carrier if they won´t behave like every other carrier ...
hlenforcer said:
where did you send it in for repair?
it is right that HTC behaves very rude if it comes to such topics, honestly i would have discussed with them, that in german law they have the need to proof that your custom rom/kernel... damaged the phone a way it would void the warranty (that is also the reason the HTC disclaimer has to say, that unlocking MAY void the warranty ...)
but in germany i never would send a phone to the manufacturer because the shop itself has to deliver a 2 year warranty. for example @ t-mobile store they remove all that can be removed (back cover, sd card if existant), send it in for repair and 24 hours later you already get your spare phone, your phone will not get analyzed until you try to switch it the third time, then they will make a test certificate.
Or did you really send it to O² and they said this to you? then i really would discuss this with the hotline and threaten them that you will change the carrier if they won´t behave like every other carrier ...
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I sent it to Arvato with some paper like warranty and stuff which o2 gave me to print and such...
I will go to o2 tomorrow and maybe I can get them giving me a new one...
Now I must use the freaking HTC wildfire.......
mmh if o² generally outsourced its repair service to this company and you signed this with your phone contract, then there would be nothing you can do about it besides to discuss german law with arvato ... if this is the case i just got a new reason to keep my more expansive t-mobile contract
edit: just checked it, they indeed outsourced their repairs to arvato and like i read it is the worst repair service available, so you have to discuss it with them
i only can give you the advice to dscuss the terms of german law regarding warranty and device modification and whish you good luck.
i read that it may help to request the boss if your concerns will be ignored (like it seems to happen more than often at this company ...)
uZzY94 said:
I bought a HTC One on April.
I am a student so this is important to me:
Cost: 660€ with urBeats headset. Paid 60€ and then I must pay 25€ each month for 2 years. Also 20€ per month for 2 years for Internet + unlimited calls in germany -> 45€/month
K.
On May I unlocked Bootloader. Then put a recovery. Then flashed a custom ROM.
I didn't like it so I flashed the original ROM back within 1-2 days
Ok.
Then 1 week ago the ONE died. It had original ROM on it and ofc unrooted.
Today they phoned me. Due to custom ROMS: No warranty.
I can pay 30€ to get the phone back unrepaired or they suggest me a amount of € I must pay to repair. This suggestion should be at my home in 1-2 days.
Nice eh? Never HTC for me.. No warranty with original ROM, yay!
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You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
ArmedandDangerous said:
You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
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You mean you have Posts: 1,112 and you still are spreading basic mis information. How do you belong to this forum and post so much without knowing the most basic information?
nullkill said:
You mean you have Posts: 1,112 and you still are spreading basic mis information. How do you belong to this forum and post so much without knowing the most basic information?
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What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
ArmedandDangerous said:
What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
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You can't sign away statutory rights. They can invalidate their warranty if they like, but they are still bound by consumer law.
BenPope said:
You can't sign away statutory rights. They can invalidate their warranty if they like, but they are still bound by consumer law.
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Depends on where you are, and where I'm from an unlocked bootloader is an instant reject. And if the damage caused from the unlocked bootloader, they have every right to reject your claim.
ArmedandDangerous said:
Depends on where you are, and where I'm from an unlocked bootloader is an instant reject. And if the damage caused from the unlocked bootloader, they have every right to reject your claim.
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The OP is in Germany, he's protected by consumer law.
ArmedandDangerous said:
What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
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Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
nullkill said:
Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
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The hardware thermal monitoring may not break, but with kernels like ElementalX with specific options to allow the phone to run hotter than allowed on stock, there is always a risk of damage.
No it does not void the warranty of a Mac if you install Windows, as bootcamp is provided for by Apple. Kernels and ROMS are NOT provided by HTC. Your warranty would be void should you overclock your GPU/RAM/CPU over long enough periods of time to cause damage unless the manufacturer you purchased those parts from explicitly says that it will cover those damage like EVGA and Intel with their K series chips. Just running a custom rom and installing kernels does not void your warranty, but if they can prove that it WAS caused by these factors, consider your warranty well and truly void.
I'm not advocating HTC's point of view, nor am I on the modder's side. Heck, my HoX has a dead NFC chip from BEFORE I unlocked my phone. Warranty got rejected, and consumer law isn't strong enough here that I can fight for it to be fixed. I'm just giving a different point of view so that everyone understands what HTC/local distributor/customers will and have faced.
Just out of curiosity (haven't rooted yet), is there any possibility of a root method that won't void warranty? That would mean not unlocking the bootloader, right? If bootloader is locked, could custom kernels still be flashed?
BenPope said:
The OP is in Germany, he's protected by consumer law.
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But wouldn't the clause on HTC about "you may void your warranty when you unlock the bootloader" take precedent first? I'm just asking.
---------- Post added at 04:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:11 AM ----------
vokkE said:
Just out of curiosity (haven't rooted yet), is there any possibility of a root method that won't void warranty? That would mean not unlocking the bootloader, right? If bootloader is locked, could custom kernels still be flashed?
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Yes if we have S-OFF
---------- Post added at 04:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:12 AM ----------
nullkill said:
Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
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HTC specifically mentioned that you may void your warranty by unlocking it. That protects them from people flashing their phones. And the consumer should read the terms and conditions of owning any device. I'm not siding with HTC but they made it clear that you may void your warranty when you unlocked your bootloader. So basically they can decide whether or not it is covered under warranty for unlocked bootloaders.
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ArmedandDangerous said:
The hardware thermal monitoring may not break, but with kernels like ElementalX with specific options to allow the phone to run hotter than allowed on stock, there is always a risk of damage.
No it does not void the warranty of a Mac if you install Windows, as bootcamp is provided for by Apple. Kernels and ROMS are NOT provided by HTC. Your warranty would be void should you overclock your GPU/RAM/CPU over long enough periods of time to cause damage unless the manufacturer you purchased those parts from explicitly says that it will cover those damage like EVGA and Intel with their K series chips. Just running a custom rom and installing kernels does not void your warranty, but if they can prove that it WAS caused by these factors, consider your warranty well and truly void.
I'm not advocating HTC's point of view, nor am I on the modder's side. Heck, my HoX has a dead NFC chip from BEFORE I unlocked my phone. Warranty got rejected, and consumer law isn't strong enough here that I can fight for it to be fixed. I'm just giving a different point of view so that everyone understands what HTC/local distributor/customers will and have faced.
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Sorry I do not support your point of view. Your POV is that we can't do anything and that you shouldn't be informed. Your rights mean nothing unless you know them. The more people who know their rights and exercise them the less we will see companies behave in this way. I will not spread false information like rooting or unlocking voids warranties which is contrary to the LAW. I will not tell people well the company said this and you have to take it. I will tell people the truth and their rights and hope they use that knowledge to exercise their rights and make the companies behave in accordance with the law. Having people such as yourself who are only trying to help (the companies) by spreading false information that isn't true making the people feel like it's not possible and there fore helping the companies take advantage of people and break the law. That plain pisses me off.
As for thermal throttling you are not 100% correct. Yes you can adjust where thermal throttling kicks in you can not disable it. The SOC will straight shutdown when the phone hits a certain temperature and will not turn back on until the device has cooled. This is a thermal shutdown that would have to malfunction in order to damage a SoC.
I understand you had a bad experience but that was due to your lack of knowledge about the laws and how to deal with companies/manufacturers and I would prefer you didn't share that kind of info with people allowing the manufactures to continue to screw us over. Good JOB!!!
And last Kernels and ROMS are provided by HTC (not well as they have some problems complying with open source). HTC and ever other manufactuer is required to provide complete source code for kernels and ROMS.
I am not trying to be mean but you need to do some research based on facts before you start telling people how it is. Of course HTC will deny as many warranty request as possible this is not new info to anyone. Every single person knows manufacturers will try and screw us over.
I am done on this topic as I am so tired of all the wrong information and people who support the companies that screw them over.
@nullkill the video about rooting will not void warranty doesn't talk about unlocking the bootloader. You can root a device without unlocking the BL.
Does the united states have consumer protection laws like this?
Sent from my HTC One
I got warranty rejected due to bootloader, called them up, told them the number of htc phones i have ( one from all generations since G1) n played dumb on bootloader and tey honoured my warranty. try that
shadowboy23 said:
But wouldn't the clause on HTC about "you may void your warranty when you unlock the bootloader" take precedent first? I'm just asking.
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Like I said, the warranty can be voided, they are not obliged to provide a warranty.
However, consumer protection law in Europe is far stronger than a warranty, and you can't sign that away.
An important note is that consumer protection law is with the retailer, not the manufacturer. The implication is that you need to deal with the retailer, not HTC.
ECEXCURSION said:
Does the united states have consumer protection laws like this?
Sent from my HTC One
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I have always assumed here in the US that unlocking an HTC device opens up the possibility that a warranty claim may be rejected. I know that many auto manufacturers, for example, have successfully denied warranty claims because the owner could not prove the oil changes were done properly. How you treat your product does make a difference; a manufacturer can reject a claim if you have abused your product outside of it's design limits (provided they warn you), be it a radio, TV, or automobile.
I think HTC has been pretty good about fixing the hardware. However, I have a different opinion than some posted here. In particular, HTC devices tend to run hot. If a bad ROM or other OS level software caused motherboard failure due to prolonged heat, I could see that HTC could take the position that they designed the hardware for a certain set of circumstances, and apparently the ROM over ran those circumstances. Even a hardware thermal cutoff may be too high over time. HTC designs the phones to last; ROM modifiers don't necessarily have the same information or inclination.
When we unlock, we essentially acknowledge that HTC is modifying the warranty in response - as they clearly state.
This stuff is my opinion; you'd have to ask a lawyer about US consumer law.
---------- Post added at 11:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:43 PM ----------
shadowboy23 said:
@nullkill the video about rooting will not void warranty doesn't talk about unlocking the bootloader. You can root a device without unlocking the BL.
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Click to collapse
How would one go about doing this? All the root methods I've seen require flashing a different recovery.
---------- Post added at 11:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 PM ----------
ArmedandDangerous said:
You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, S-Off would not matter in this case; the phone was dead, and the user could not take advantage of S-Off to reset to stock...
Hello I want to share with you my very long conversation with HTC support Europe.
Conversation is unedited exactly as happened.
Please excuse me for my bad English.
My first message:
Hello, my brand new HTC ONE break over 3 months ago. All this time I’m trying to exchange my HTC ONE but your Bulgarian distributor Vivacom refuse warranty exchange. I have all necessary documents from your official Bulgarian warranty service Most Computers, certifying that the phone is faulty and should be replaced by a new. Yet Vivacom refuse to replace it. Now I am faced with the need to pursue a court case against Vivacom to replace my phone. I am very disappointed by your warranty. HTC ONE is a great phone but in Bulgaria warranty is horrible. I will never buy another HTC product. Best Regards, Lyubomir
HTC support replay Nemanja :
Thank you for contacting HTC. Dear Mr. Lybomir, as you said yourself, HTC did everything it could and provided all the necessary papers. Now the issue you have is with Vivacom and there is little we can do regarding that. You need to clarify this issue with them. If you need any more assistance from HTC or there is something you think we should do please do inform us.
My second message:
Thank you very much four you great support!
Serious companies stand behind their products. The phone is made by you, and if a technical problem arise you have to take responsibility for addressing this problem. Instead, you simply sell your phones at extremely unfair bad traders like Vivacom and then you do not care. When any problem occurs only advice that you give me - you're on your own!
Thank you again!
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, we as a company don't have sale shops and we do not sell devices ourselves. The behavior and refusal of certain companies is not HTC responsibility as this will be considered as meddling in other company business. We have done everything from our side and we approved the replacement for your case. We did everything correctly and in order to satisfy the customer but unfortunately we cannot make other companies do their job. We are sorry for the inconvenience you are having.
My third message:
Dear Nemanja, it's looks that you do not understand me correctly. Every major brand that I have had to deal, either Samsung, Microsoft, Apple, Nokia have a very simple and effective method to deal with rogue traders as Vivacom. When you have insoluble dispute with merchants they offer you to send your phone directly to the headquarters when phone will be tested and if necessary replaced. Can you tell me why HTC does not offer this option? I want to send the phone back to you in Taiwan for warranty service! Thank you!
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, please contact customer protection agency in your country and ask them to intervene in your case. HTC has done everything in its power to help and now because of Vivacom we are looking unprofessional although there is no fault of ours and we approved you the new device. By contacting your customer protection agency you will save HTC and yourself from further complications and issues.
My fourth message:
Dear Nemanja,
I already contact my customer protection agency, a month ago. I have decision from them that is in my favor. In official document that was issued to me by Bulgarian customer protection agency is saying that my phone needs to be replaced immediately by Vivavcom. But Vivavcom refuse to comply with this decision. Bulgarian customer protection agency has no legal means to force Vivacom to comply with the decision.
So now I'm forced to start expensive and long lawsuit!
That is the situation!
Thank you
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lyubomir, I understand perfectly your reason for dissatisfaction and the predicament that you are in. I don't know why the Vivacom is behaving like this as you have all the necessary papers and proofs for device exchange. We would be more than happy to assist you but in your case we already did all that we could and there are no options left on our disposal at the moment. If you want we can try to send the device to our service centre again and check if it can be repaired. Otherwise, your only solution is to proceed with lawsuit against Vivacom. Once again I apologize for the inconvenience and I hope that your issue will be resolved soon. Please keep us posted on your case and what is happening with it. Thank you for your understanding and I wish you all the best.
My fifth message:
Dear Nemanja, It's now perfectly clear for me that I can not count on any help from HTC. I want to inform you that I intend to to publish our entire conversation in internet. I do this in order to inform users of Android phones on the terms of the HTC warranty service and difficulties which may arise in front of them if they live in Bulgaria. Best Regards
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Thank you for contacting HTC. Dear Mr. Lybomir, we don't have any issues with you posting our conversation as we did everything we could but you simply cannot accept that there is limit to what HTC can do. Once again, HTC gave you the paper to take new phone and I even offered to try and repair it again. On the other side, VIvacom totally ignored you and your request. Accordingly, if you think this is HTC issue or you are not satisfied with our approval for new phone -please proceed with your intention. Contrary to your opinion and as I explained earlier, we cannot force Vivacom to do something as it is not part of HTC company and they are separate business. Their inability or unwillingness to help cannot and is not HTC fault!
My sixth message:
I don't understand you. What do you mean by this "... I even offered to try and repair it again.?" When the phone will be repaired? As far as I know safe repair for HTC ONE is not possible. You said also "HTC gave you the paper to take new phone"? Why does the phone have to be repaired and not just replaced? Also you did not answer my question why I can't send my phone directly to your headquarters or other service center in Europe where can be tested and, if necessary, be repaired or replaced? Thank you
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, by offer of repair I meant for you to send the device once again to double check if it can be repaired or no. When I said "HTC gave you the paper to take new phone" I meant that our Bulgarian HTC office gave you proof to go and take another phone from your retailer. If you wish, you can send the phone to our service centre and if it is faulty they will again give you the proof with which you need to contact your retailer for replacement. Once again, we have really tried to help you but there is little we can do now. I understand that you are now venting your anger on HTC (probably Vivacom will not answer your calls or e-mails) but this doesn't change the fact that we already did everything in our power. If you want, I can even call you and explain all of this to you in person just to understand that we are on the same page and that we understand each other what can be done and what can't.
My seventh message:
Dear Nemanja, can you just answer me to my main question : why I can't send my phone directly to HTC headquarters or other service center in Europe where can be tested and, if necessary, be repaired or replaced? I know that you have service center in Romania, that is closest to me. About your other suggestion, if your Bulgarian HTC office is Most Computers I already did that. When preparing my documents for lawsuit against Vivacom on 09.09.2013 I went to Most Computers when they give me exactly the same document that is proving that my phone is faulty and must be replayed. I think that something is wrong with you warrant policy in Bulgaria. I have prof that phone is faulty from your official HTC representative in Bulgaria Most Computers, but they do not give me new phone, instead send me to Vivacom. Why? Thank you
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, you are aware that HTC doesn't have any shop and is not selling phones by single unit. We are not the sellers and we provide local retailers with quantities of phones so the y can sell them. If they sell the phone and collect money from you for that same phone is it ok for HTC to replace it and pay from its own pocket while Vivacom keeps the money just because they refuse to deal with customer? If we re-send the phone to Romania or any other service centre they will again issue the paper for replacement and in the end you will again have to deal with Vivacom. Can we ask what is going on now between you and Vivacom? Do they call you or are they in contact via e-mail with you? Do they do anything regarding this case or is only HTC trying to explain and help you to conclude the issue? Mr. Lybomir, please understand that we did everything we could in your case. From our side we gave all we could and we provided the means for you to take new phone. I understand that you feel the need to complain and I understand that you are angry but that doesn't change the fact that there is nothing else we can do for you. Please try to close your pending issue with Vivacom as they are the one at fault in this matter.
My eighth message:
Dear Nemanja, Yes I understand that HTC doesn't have any shop . But now I'm very confused by your explanation. As far as I understand you sell phones to Most Computers, they sell phones to Vivacom and Vivacom sell phone to me. So if we trace the flow of money you get money from Most Computers they get money from Vivatel and of course Vivatel get money from me. And now comes the tricky question - who is responsible for warranty service? Vivacom don't have any repair services for that I'm sure so that mean that you or your official representative in Bulgaria. Most computers must repair or exchange my faulty phone. Right? If that is not true it's mean that you actually do not have warranty service in Bulgaria! According to Bulgarian and EU law you must provide every phone with 24 months warranty service! Most big companies care about they public image, but from what you say it appears that you simply sell your phones without a care for anything else. If that is the case I don't understand why someone will bye HTC phones instead of unknown Chines phones that is 100% copy of HTC phones but is much more cheaper ! Dear Nemanja, can you escalate my complaint to your superiors? Thank you
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, no, we don't sale phones to Most computers, they are only service centre. Regarding warranty, yes, there is warranty coverage and in your case service centre checked the device under warranty and determined that it cannot be repaired so they gave the paper to replace the phone. Dear Mr. Lybomir, again, we can continue this correspondence indefinitely but it will not change the fact that HTC did all it could and you need to take up your issue with Vivacom. Also, yes, I can ask my customer care manager to call you but as I said before, he will provide you with the same explanation and information I did. Can you please answer to my previous question regarding contact with Vivacom? Inform us what is going on now between you and Vivacom? Do they call you or are they in contact via e-mail with you? Do they do anything regarding this case or is only HTC trying to explain and help you to conclude the issue?
My ninth message:
Dear Nemanja, Answer to your questions: "Can we ask what is going on now between you and Vivacom? Do they call you or are they in contact via e-mail with you? Do they do anything regarding this case or is only HTC trying to explain and help you to conclude the issue? " In the past 3 months I try every possible way of contacting Vivacom. I write them maybe 15 e-mail, call they technical support numberses times and go in person to their shop/ office at lest 10 times. Result of all this my activity is 0. In the beginning they promised to replace my phone when they have HTC One silver in stock. But this was just another lie from them. Now they don't call me or contact me via e-mail and as far as I know they do absolutely nothing regarding my case! From now my contacts with Vivatel will be only through my lawyer. For some reason they really want lawsuit and will get one! Dear Nemanja please inform your customer care manager that I will file a complaint against HTC warranty service in European Commission - consumers protection through European Consumer Center.
Thank you!
HTC support replay Nemanja:
Dear Mr. Lybomir, that was exactly the reason I asked about you and Vivacom. I presumed that Vivacom has ignored you completely and now you are expressing your dissatisfaction and anger at HTC as we are the only one answering and talking to you and we are the only one who actually did something (provided paper for exchange). Again, I understand this but it will in no way change the status of your case. I don't know how to try and explain that HTC did everything in your case and provided what it was available to it. I will make sure to send my customer care manager your information regarding complaint.
The title should be "How does the Vivacom support works". Not HTC. They're right. Since they're the only ones responding to you, you're blaming them, when the real people to sue, is vivacom (or whoever is refusing to replace your phone).
aooga said:
The title should be "How does the Vivacom support works". Not HTC. They're right. Since they're the only ones responding to you, you're blaming them, when the real people to sue, is vivacom (or whoever is refusing to replace your phone).
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Of course I will sue Vivacom. But if you read entire post you will clearly see that HTC support is not providing any real help.
Lyubon said:
Of course I will sue Vivacom. But if you read entire post you will clearly see that HTC support is not providing any real help.
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Because they cant! What do you expect them to do? Give you a new phone? I know you must be mad, but dont blame HTC. They truly did all they could besides suing vivacom for you.
agora:
Let us imagine the following hypothetical situation. You are buying a brand new HTC ONE from Walmart somewhere in San Diego. After only five days of use your phone break. And you decide to send it to the nearest HTC USA service center for repair. From this center, after a few days they returne to you the same faulty phone, plus one sheet of paper on which is written, that your phone is beyond repair and should be replaced by Walmart. Here now, the question arises why your phone is not replaced by HTC service center? However you decide to put up with it and you're going to Walmart and show them document from HTC USA.
Employees in Walmart tell you that they have signed a contract with HTC USA to service and replace when necessary faulty phones. And they say that the phone had to be replaced in the service center where the fault has been detected. They refuse to give you new phone.
In such instances, who do you think is responsible?
In my view Walmart and HTC USA both violated your consumer rights and refuse to fulfill their obligations under the warranty service.
Consumer protection law clearly states that it is the retailer, not the manufacturer that is responsible. Your anger is misguided.
I just want to clarify that I do not write this post just to guide my anger on HTC.
Maybe cases like mine can not happen in the U.S. however I'm sure that is very common in other part of the world.
From one side you have crooks retailers in may case Vivacom and from others you have unhelpful and irresponsible manufacturer like HTC.
If you living in the country where often the law is interpreted by corrupt judges and usually the case is won by the one who has more money, it is very difficult for the average person to protect his interests.
Lyubon said:
I just want to clarify that I do not write this post just to guide my anger on HTC.
Maybe cases like mine can not happen in the U.S. however I'm sure that is very common in other part of the world.
From one side you have crooks retailers in may case Vivacom and from others you have unhelpful and irresponsible manufacturer like HTC.
If you living in the country where often the law is interpreted by corrupt judges and usually the case is won by the one who has more money, it is very difficult for the average person to protect his interests.
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Click to collapse
I see your point, but what the heck do you want from HTC? I don't get it. A new phone? Them to sue vivacom for you?
In the US, it wouldn't happen because since most of us here buy phones from carriers with a contract, they are obligated to provide warranty service if the phone wasn't accidentally damaged. There are no "htc telling someone that they should have the phone replaced". I guess the laws are a bit stricter here.
Anyway, did you manage to get a replacement from vivacom, or do you have to result to suing them?
aooga said:
I see your point, but what the heck do you want from HTC? I don't get it. A new phone? Them to sue vivacom for you?
In the US, it wouldn't happen because since most of us here buy phones from carriers with a contract, they are obligated to provide warranty service if the phone wasn't accidentally damaged. There are no "htc telling someone that they should have the phone replaced". I guess the laws are a bit stricter here.
Anyway, did you manage to get a replacement from vivacom, or do you have to result to suing them?
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Hi aooga, yes I want to send my phone back directly to manufacturer HTC, for diagnostic and if they find that phone is broken I want to be replaced. It's written in my first post.
No I didn't manage to get a replacement from Vivacom and I think that this is impossible, because they are just crooks who want to steal your money. This week I'm starting lawsuit against thieves from Vivacom. But it is slow and cumbersome procedure. If I win they most likely will appeal and all this can take up to one year.
I had a somewhat similar case with Apple iPhone. Two years ago I bought my iPhone 4S, and after a few months of use the phone broke. I took it to the dealer from which was purchased, but they refused to replace it with the argument that phone have water damage. Of course this is a lie. So I contact Apple and send phone directly to them for diagnostic. After only a few days Apple send me new phone without any questions. Perhaps I expected something similar from HTC. But HTC just told me that they not care about my problem. Very disappointing.
Lyubon said:
Hi aooga, yes I want to send my phone back directly to manufacturer HTC, for diagnostic and if they find that phone is broken I want to be replaced. It's written in my first post.
No I didn't manage to get a replacement from Vivacom and I think that this is impossible, because they are just crooks who want to steal your money. This week I'm starting lawsuit against thieves from Vivacom. But it is slow and cumbersome procedure. If I win they most likely will appeal and all this can take up to one year.
I had a somewhat similar case with Apple iPhone. Two years ago I bought my iPhone 4S, and after a few months of use the phone broke. I took it to the dealer from which was purchased, but they refused to replace it with the argument that phone have water damage. Of course this is a lie. So I contact Apple and send phone directly to them for diagnostic. After only a few days Apple send me new phone without any questions. Perhaps I expected something similar from HTC. But HTC just told me that they not care about my problem. Very disappointing.
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Yeah, apple does that. HTC doesn't do that in your country i guess. They do in the US. Hope you get it resolved in some way
Lyubon said:
Hi aooga, yes I want to send my phone back directly to manufacturer HTC, for diagnostic and if they find that phone is broken I want to be replaced.
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Click to collapse
They've offered to have another look for s repair.
I understand your frustration, but I'd be surprised if manufacturers of other electrical goods would give replacements in this scenario.
HTC did everything they should in this situation.
To answer the question as to why HTC can not just give you a new phone, they are a very large company, and in your country the retailer is responsible for the warranty process, not the manufacturer, so if they did replace your phone they would be setting a precedent that they must replace every phone from everyone with complaints of Vivacom. Why would they do that? You are not their customer, Vivacom is. You did not buy the phone from HTC, Vivacom did. If you purchase a car and it has a problem do you drive it back to the factory where it was manufactured, or do you take it yo the dealership that sold it to you? There is a process for this sort of thing, and everyone must follow it. Vivacom is the one ignoring the process, Vivacom is the one refusing you, Vivacom is the one ignoring you.
I'm sorry that you have to go through this, and I can completely understand your frustration, but HTC is in the right here.
HTC sold the device to Vivacom at wholesale price, Vivacom sold it to you at retail price. You are Vivacom's customer, not HTC's. Vivacom has a responsibility as a retailer to handle any issues you have, and make sure you are happy with your purchase. HTC does not, they have a responsibility to supply Vivacom, and that is all.
In a perfect world, it would be wonderful if every devices warranty worked like Apple's, but they do not, and the world is not perfect. You anger is justifiable, the direction in which you're aiming it is not.
AT&T HTC M7ul
Baad Newz's InsertCoin 3.4-2
Flar2's Bulletproof 6.2
BenPope said:
They've offered to have another look for s repair.
I understand your frustration, but I'd be surprised if manufacturers of other electrical goods would give replacements in this scenario.
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Click to collapse
Hi. this is HTC offer to me:
"If you wish, you can send the phone to our service centre and if it is faulty they will again give you the proof with which you need to contact your retailer for replacement." HTC support Nemanja. So actually they just offer me to give me just another useless piece of paper. I already have two of this "proofs" but this make no difference just because Vivacom are thieves that are not interested in "proofs" or any evidence.
CoryTallman said:
HTC did everything they should in this situation.
To answer the question as to why HTC can not just give you a new phone, they are a very large company, and in your country the retailer is responsible for the warranty process, not the manufacturer, so if they did replace your phone they would be setting a precedent that they must replace every phone from everyone with complaints of Vivacom. Why would they do that? You are not their customer, Vivacom is. You did not buy the phone from HTC, Vivacom did. If you purchase a car and it has a problem do you drive it back to the factory where it was manufactured, or do you take it yo the dealership that sold it to you? There is a process for this sort of thing, and everyone must follow it. Vivacom is the one ignoring the process, Vivacom is the one refusing you, Vivacom is the one ignoring you.
I'm sorry that you have to go through this, and I can completely understand your frustration, but HTC is in the right here.
HTC sold the device to Vivacom at wholesale price, Vivacom sold it to you at retail price. You are Vivacom's customer, not HTC's. Vivacom has a responsibility as a retailer to handle any issues you have, and make sure you are happy with your purchase. HTC does not, they have a responsibility to supply Vivacom, and that is all.
In a perfect world, it would be wonderful if every devices warranty worked like Apple's, but they do not, and the world is not perfect. You anger is justifiable, the direction in which you're aiming it is not.
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I see your point, and I can even agree with some of your thesis if we live in a perfect world full with honеst retailers and custom caring manufacturers. What you will do if you bye car and suddenly find that manufacturer don't have repair service in your country? Тhe whole problem is that HTC do not have adequate warranty service in my country. If they have one my phone would be replaced directly by the service. I don't know much about perfect world, but I know that in our world Apple is onе of the biggest and most profitable manufacturer while HTC is very close to bankruptcy. So after all maybe good custom care is part of the equation of corporate success.
HTC UK Support
Here in the UK, HTC has a contract with Regenersis to take care of their customers, they're the ones who provide the staff to repair, replace and communicate with HTC's customers, when ever you're communicating with customer support you should know that it is not HTC directly you're speaking with.
LG and Samsung use the same contractor as well for UK support.
Barbast said:
.....when ever you're communicating with customer support you should know that it is not HTC directly you're speaking with......
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Hi, my communication with customer support is trough HTC site and I definitely speaking directly with HTC.
Lyubon said:
Hi. this is HTC offer to me:
"If you wish, you can send the phone to our service centre and if it is faulty they will again give you the proof with which you need to contact your retailer for replacement." HTC support Nemanja. So actually they just offer me to give me just another useless piece of paper. I already have two of this "proofs" but this make no difference just because Vivacom are thieves that are not interested in "proofs" or any evidence.
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I think you need to read their response to your 4th message.
---------- Post added at 10:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:44 AM ----------
Lyubon said:
Тhe whole problem is that HTC do not have adequate warranty service in my country.
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The whole point is that it is NOT HTCs responsibility.
BenPope said:
The whole point is that it is NOT HTCs responsibility.
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Yes I know HTC responsibility is just to take your money.
Lyubon said:
Yes I know HTC responsibility is just to take your money.
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Except you didn't give any money to HTC, did you?
You're acting like a child.
BenPope said:
Except you didn't give any money to HTC, did you?
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BINGO! :good:
I'm dying to get root (event temp) so I can chroot debian but due to the apparent flimsiness of the dock am a little scared to loose warranty coverage.
What are the real consequences of unlocking on warranty? If the hinge or connector breaks (hardware issuss) does Asus just turn it away if unlocked?
I don't know how Asus handle this, but I know from Sony and HTC that there never was a problem when unlocked. Just if you grill your processor or hardbrick the phone MAYbe they refuse, but I never ever heard something like this.
If the dock breaks it more common that a seller states that it is your fault because of using too much force.... But they can't refuse warranty on hardware dock because of rooting the tablet...
A friend hardbricked his Samsung and the message from service center was that it fell on the floor I guess in most cases they can't tell if you brick if it's from rooting/flashing or not....
I talked to Asus polish support yesterday, about this. The guy said that when you unlock the bootloader, you loose WHOLE warranty.
He even said that if you bought yours with keyboard dock, you loose your warranty on that too.
huball said:
I talked to Asus polish support yesterday, about this. The guy said that when you unlock the bootloader, you loose WHOLE warranty.
He even said that if you bought yours with keyboard dock, you loose your warranty on that too.
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He can say that, but I don't believe that they would have any chance in court...
huball said:
I talked to Asus polish support yesterday, about this. The guy said that when you unlock the bootloader, you loose WHOLE warranty.
He even said that if you bought yours with keyboard dock, you loose your warranty on that too.
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Yup. Unlocking any asus tablets fully voids your warranty. But I don't know how they can deny warranty on the dock if you just send the dock.
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
aznmode said:
Yup. Unlocking any asus tablets fully voids your warranty. But I don't know how they can deny warranty on the dock if you just send the dock.
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
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Because that's what you agree to when you unlock...
The text you have to agree to before you use the unlock tool doesn't leave any doubt's: You kiss your warranty good bye - no matter what. There have been cases where TF700 users got a warranty repair even after unlocking. But I would not count on it. And you certainly cannot demand it.
Unless you live in the EU, it seems. Stronger consumer protection laws seem to give users a leg up, so research your country's laws.
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using Tapatalk 4
Yezariael said:
He can say that, but I don't believe that they would have any chance in court...
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Huh? Got that kind of money do you? Know the law do you? Those guys are the 5th largest PC vendor in the world. Go for it I dare ya.
Anyway if you search on this you find some that tried to send it back and they WOULD NOT fix it. Wanted to charge them hundreds of dollors to fix. Yet I think I remember someone that got it fixed. Not worth it. Its ASUS
Zeblade said:
Huh? Got that kind of money do you? Know the law do you? Those guys are the 5th largest PC vendor in the world.
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Yeah, I know the (Swiss) laws, and if I need a good lawyer I have an insurance for this Anyway, consumer have a lot of rights, at least in Switzerland and EU, and a company cannot deny any warranty. If the defect is a consequence of unlocking they could, but not if the dock is not working properly... The problem is, most people would not go to court because of this 500 bucks...
In Europe (EU) they can't deny warranty by law. Doesn't matter what Asus tells on their website.
When for example the dock cnnector is broken and you are unlocked the manufacturer MUST PROOF that the malfunction was caused by unlocking the device and they can't.
Would they reject warranty then a letter of a lawyer does miracles.
Hi, here in Germany we have two warranties. One comes from the law and helps you six months, after this time you have to prove that the damage existed from the beginning which is practically nearly not possible. They can´t deny you this warranty as it´s a law.
The other warranty which comes from the manufacturer is something they can deny as it is voluntary.
So at least for me right now I don´t want to root even though I really want to root .
My question belonging to this is if there will be a chance to root without unlocking the bootloader? As I read that unlocking the bootloader on an Android device helps in first place to install a custom rom. So getting root with the stock kernel schouldn´t void any warranty...
SHadowral said:
My question belonging to this is if there will be a chance to root without unlocking the bootloader? As I read that unlocking the bootloader on an Android device helps in first place to install a custom rom. So getting root with the stock kernel schouldn´t void any warranty...
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There is. On other devices some developers made it possible, but usually it takes "some" time... can be tomorrow, can be in 1 year, can be never... Has nothing to do with stock kernel, when you can install a recovery you can change kernel, too. With official unlock tools like Asus or Sony are doing they get a database with all unlocked devices... What they do with this data is another question
Thanks, i´ll patiently wait for the day to come
asus reply
So as most will know, my TF701 is unlocked.
I do have trouble with the dock connector, I agree it's annoying.
So I contacted the ASUS support of doom, to find out more (I don't actually think of returning it, I just wondered).
As the The unlocker phones home, my warranty is bust.
Dear Mr. Dunwell,
thank you for your email request.
This unit is Out of Warranty due to Unlock device.
In the case of an under warranty repair is first created a cost estimate.
Here, a service fee in the amount of about 135 CHF.
This amount is also refusing to pay the cost estimate, and covers the cost of inspection and the shipping of the unrepaired unit.
It is not possible for us to name the price in advance without having to inspect the equipment, please be understanding of this.
1. Please fill in the relavant warranty application (3. Send in Service - Einsendung defekter Ware) form for your product, by clicking on the link:
https://eu-rma.asus.com/pick_eu/ch_d/eee.html
2. After approval of the submitted data you will receive the RMA number and shipping instructions from us by e-mail.
3. Please read our Terms & Conditions before filling in the RMA forms.
Please don't hesitate to contact us, if you have any questions.
We are committed to customer satisfaction.
You will receive in the next few days by e-mail a link to your satisfaction survey.
We would be very happy if you take the survey and evaluate our service.
Your answers will help us identify the areas where we could improve.
Sincerely,
Mehmet Adyakar
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do I learn of this?
Screw ASUS support
Wait for diy fix to appear
lpdunwell said:
So as most will know, my TF701 is unlocked.
I do have trouble with the dock connector, I agree it's annoying.
So I contacted the ASUS support of doom, to find out more (I don't actually think of returning it, I just wondered).
As the The unlocker phones home, my warranty is bust.
What do I learn of this?
Screw ASUS support
Wait for diy fix to appear
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CHF - you're in Switzerland? Check your consumer protection laws. You guys in Europe are much better off than us here in the US. Netherlands and I believe Germany does not let Asus get away with voiding the warranty just because you unlock. So check the laws in your country...
berndblb said:
CHF - you're in Switzerland? Check your consumer protection laws. You guys in Europe are much better off than us here in the US. Netherlands and I believe Germany does not let Asus get away with voiding the warranty just because you unlock. So check the laws in your country...
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Yes, Switzerland. Thanks. I will! I replied to ASUS and asked about that.
Besides that, I always hate returning things. If there's a way to get it sorted with little hassle, that's my choice.
IMHO the only thing worse than warranty with broken electronics is broken guns. -.-
lpdunwell said:
Yes, Switzerland. Thanks. I will! I replied to ASUS and asked about that.
Besides that, I always hate returning things. If there's a way to get it sorted with little hassle, that's my choice.
IMHO the only thing worse than warranty with broken electronics is broken guns. -.-
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Indeed here in Holland they can't refuse the warranty because of unlocking. In fact ASUS must proof that the connector problem was caused by unlocking the device and they can't of course.
Sent from my superfast Asus Infinity TF701with Dock
lpdunwell said:
Yes, Switzerland. Thanks. I will! I replied to ASUS and asked about that.
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Do you have an insurance for things like that? (Rechtsschutzversicherung) They would do the work, as I don't believe that Asus will say "Oh yes, Swiss guy, no problem!"
I had a tf700 which I'd unlocked, rooted, etc..
The display developed a few solid rows of red pixels depending on pressure from the dock hinge. I sent the unit in under RMA and they replaced the screen and sent it back. It was returned still unlocked and loaded w/ the same OS load I sent it in with. No questions asked.
My expectation is that if the issue could be software related to something you've done, then you'll be in a pickle.. but if it's actually hardware, they'll honor things without problem (at least, that was my experience).
LK
linuxkidd said:
I had a tf700 which I'd unlocked, rooted, etc..
The display developed a few solid rows of red pixels depending on pressure from the dock hinge. I sent the unit in under RMA and they replaced the screen and sent it back. It was returned still unlocked and loaded w/ the same OS load I sent it in with. No questions asked.
My expectation is that if the issue could be software related to something you've done, then you'll be in a pickle.. but if it's actually hardware, they'll honor things without problem (at least, that was my experience).
LK
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That is nice and all but your speaking for Asus and you can't. We always find that one person on that one day that didn't do their job. You got lucky. I am sure more posts like this will help Asus really slack off more.
I just read last week someone sold their Tf700 unlocked on ebay. The buyer new all this bought it anyway. The screen cut out a month later Asus would NOT touch it unless the guy gave up about $150. The unlock had nothing todo with the screen what so ever.
So NEVER listen to posts like this. You void the warranty and you want them to look the other way. Granted I don't know one time a unlock was the cause of a broken tablet lol but Man if you ever learned anything then remember when you took that tag of your mattress and look what happen.. what happen? Yeah
Zeblade said:
That is nice and all but your speaking for Asus and you can't....
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linuxkidd said:
...My expectation is that ...
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Nope.. not speaking for Asus.. Giving my expectation, not policy of Asus (as caveated with "My expectation is that...")
Zeblade said:
...I just read last week someone sold their Tf700 unlocked on ebay. The buyer new all this bought it anyway. The screen cut out a month later Asus would NOT touch it unless the guy gave up about $150. The unlock had nothing todo with the screen what so ever....
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I believe you found the reason it wasn't honored right here... Warranty almost never transfers across owners. They (in general, not speaking specifically for Asus) usually state that they are only good for the original owner of the device.
It is true that either
A) I found the one person (or persons... ) slacking in their job and they replaced a hardware component which was clearly defective and had nothing to do with the device being unlocked.
or
B) The few other people who've had issues found the one or two people who were being dicks.
Either way, the story you provide doesn't even apply due to the tablet not being with the original owner.
LK
Hi,
I am sorry if this common knowledge around here, but it took me a while to find so I thought it might be worth posting this info here.
I am considering rooting just so that I can save large files from games to my sd card, I was worried about this knox thing (never had a Samsung before) and voiding my warranty just so I can do this.
I have found the following post that seems to confirm that rooting alone DOES NOT void your warranty if you are in the UK, regardless of what happens to Knox...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1998801
This forum is obviously international and this just applies to the EU, but I thought it worth posting if it helps others like it helped me.
WARNING!!!
Before you unknowingly get people into bad situation you might want to consider this post as-well. Your link is very old and has been refused on several instances. Basically has not created any useful precedence to my knowledge.
Also KNOX put a whole new spin on the issue.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=45570695&postcount=4
I posted it before in one of the topic, but Im gonna repost again.
Regarding this topic discussed and this EU directive, I contacted both, Samsung Latvia, aswell as Consumer Rights Protection Centre.
In short - Samsung still stands on its warranty card, saying that rooting will void the warranty.
CRPC States, that they take sides with Samsung. Because they have such point in warranty, they cannot "protect me".
So only way something would change in Latvia (its in EU) is, if I would take Samsung to court telling that, the "rooting voids warranty" point in their warranty card is against EU rules (or w/e rules) and court would agree on me. No way Im doing that
Whats unofficial way of dealing against KNOX 0x1 when you take your phone to warranty service center is different story. Sometimes they might just fix your phone under warranty and reset the fuse (Like it was sayd in different post). Just dont count on that.
Hmmm, thanks,
This looks to be a very complex area, I was not meaning to mislead and I apologise if that's what has happened.
There looks to be a lot of concussion over who the warranty is actually with, either EE (in my case) or Samsung. I have to admit I don't understand the difference, if there is some law that states that the phone should be covered by the warranty, then what does it matter who it is with?
Has there been no precedent of someone having their phone rooted and still having it covered under warranty?
i also don't understand why Knox changed things? My understanding from reading some Samsung press is that Knox is designed for business platforms where the 'one device for work and home' idea can be supported by corporations it departments to make sure the devices are safe. It's disappointing that this same technology prevents personal users from doing what we want with our phones.
i appreciate that all I am trying to do is save large files (in this case for games) is a google policy change, not Samsung, but if rooting is the only way that I can utilise the expansion that the SD offers then it's also disappointing that this would void my warranty?!
I understand the 'root voids warranty' that is plastered all over can, but am just asking...
btw
I do not understand why even the warranty is lost just because I got root??? whether it is this or that Samsung or HTC or some other mobile.
I find it this is an old primitive law.
For me it means: root = admin
Fo example: I'm admin on my PC with Win7 and I still do have warranty for all my coponents or?
Just try to imagine you loose warranty for your motherboard or graphik card cos you have admin rights. lol
A S5 is for me like an PC that I can use how I want it to.
In Sweden we have a nice law for the consumer.
Warranty is totally optional. Samsung voids the warranty when rooting but we have something called "reklamationsrätt".
This forces the seller (not Samsung) to fix the phone (factory faults) within 3 years from purchase. The store has to solve the problem with Samsung (not our problem).
http://www.hallakonsument.se/other-languages/other-languages/english-engelska1/consumer-sales-act/
"During the first six months after the purchase, it is up to the seller to prove that the fault did not exist when the good was first purchased. When more than six months have passed after the purchase, the onus is upon you as the purchaser, to prove that the fault existed from the very beginning.
According to the Consumer Sales Act, your right to complain expires three years after you received the good. This applies to goods and services you purchased on that day or later. The product may have a guarantee period shorter than three years, but this does not shorten the complaint period according to the act."
Burden of proof is much higher for businesses compared to the consumer.
We really don't need the warranty here.
It is always optional for the seller to provide guarantees. They can't negotiate their way around "reklamationsrätten" regulated in the consumer purchases act. IT'S THE LAW!
Read about warranty here:
http://www.hallakonsument.se/other-languages/other-languages/english-engelska1/warranties/
So, if they can't prove that the fault is caused by root, they can't deny us to get it fixes. After the six months they will still fix obvious errors that can not be explained by root or bad use. As I said, the burden of proof is much lower for the consumer.
Other countries could have laws like this? At least within EU?
Edit:
I understand why Samsung voids the warranty. Samsung can't be held responsible for problems with the software on the phone if you have modified it. Then it is not something that Samsung want's to waste money on to fix. It's your problem.
Orka82 said:
In Sweden we have a nice law for the consumer.
Warranty is totally optional. Samsung voids the warranty when rooting but we have something called "reklamationsrätt".
This forces the seller (not Samsung) to fix the phone (factory faults) within 3 years from purchase. The store has to solve the problem with Samsung (not our problem).
http://www.konsumentverket.se/otherlanguages/English/Consumer-rights/Defective-goodsComplaint-/
"During the first six months after the purchase, it is up to the seller to prove that the fault did not exist when the good was first purchased. When more than six months have passed after the purchase, the onus is upon you as the purchaser, to prove that the fault existed from the very beginning.
According to the Consumer Purchases Act, your right to complain expires three years after you received the good. This applies to goods and services you purchased on that day or later. The product may have a guarantee period shorter than three years, but this does not shorten the complaint period according to the act."
Burden of proof is much higher for businesses compared to the consumer.
We really don't need the warranty here.
It is always optional for the seller to provide guarantees. They can't negotiate their way around "reklamationsrätten" regulated in the consumer purchases act. IT'S THE LAW!
Read about warranty here:
http://www.konsumentverket.se/otherlanguages/English/Consumer-rights/Guarantee/
So, if they can't prove that the fault is caused by root, they can't deny us to get it fixes. After the six months they will still fix obvious errors that can not be explained by root or bad use. As I said, the burden of proof is much lower for the consumer.
Other countries could have laws like this? At least within EU?
Edit:
I understand why Samsung voids the warranty. Samsung can't be held responsible for problems with the software on the phone if you have modified it. Then it is not something that Samsung want's to waste money on to fix. It's your problem.
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Nice post. I can't understand why they can't just void the software side of warranty...
craigcrawford1988 said:
Nice post. I can't understand why they can't just void the software side of warranty...
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I rooted my Galaxy S 5 the second day I got it but that was my choice and whenever you root your device you must realise the minute something goes wrong it is your own responsibility to fix it. The software in an android phone is responsible for a lot of aspects considering hardware like managing how hot and fast the cpu is, how your light works, your file system etc. The hardware is designed in a very specific manner and is set to run in a specific manner, when you root your phone you can change all that. You can force the hardware to run in "untested" ways so Samsung and other mobile manufacturers will not support when things go wrong because you use the phone in the way it wasn't designed to do.
I wouldn't go jumping on the rooting bandwagon if you're unsure about anything. I'd say do your research first and ask yourself why you want to root and also ask yourself are you going to be able to afford to fix it when things go wrong? I rooted my phone to change how my phone looks and get rid of things I don't need. Just remember when you root you cannot expect to receive help from the manufacturer when it goes wrong.
gareth261987 said:
I rooted my Galaxy S 5 the second day I got it but that was my choice and whenever you root your device you must realise the minute something goes wrong it is your own responsibility to fix it. The software in an android phone is responsible for a lot of aspects considering hardware like managing how hot and fast the cpu is, how your light works, your file system etc. The hardware is designed in a very specific manner and is set to run in a specific manner, when you root your phone you can change all that. You can force the hardware to run in "untested" ways so Samsung and other mobile manufacturers will not support when things go wrong because you use the phone in the way it wasn't designed to do.
I wouldn't go jumping on the rooting bandwagon if you're unsure about anything. I'd say do your research first and ask yourself why you want to root and also ask yourself are you going to be able to afford to fix it when things go wrong? I rooted my phone to change how my phone looks and get rid of things I don't need. Just remember when you root you cannot expect to receive help from the manufacturer when it goes wrong.
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Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
Stiflerlv said:
Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
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the computer is still more robust in that sense, also if you deleted files from windows which you shouldn't delete then the manufacturer would not fix it for free. If you fried the motherboard due to over clocking your computer that too wouldn't be covered by warranty. Now am not defending the manufacturers but with the amount of people that brick phones or root without knowing what they're doing would cost a lot of money to rectify.
Stiflerlv said:
Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
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:good: :good: :good: :good: :good:
gareth261987 said:
the computer is still more robust in that sense, also if you deleted files from windows which you shouldn't delete then the manufacturer would not fix it for free. If you fried the motherboard due to over clocking your computer that too wouldn't be covered by warranty. Now am not defending the manufacturers but with the amount of people that brick phones or root without knowing what they're doing would cost a lot of money to rectify.
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and I would never go for service center just because of software glitch... Reinstall and move on. Same goes for Phones. Its normal if they wouldnt cover software problems with rooted phones, and approch same way you can apporch computers - reinstall -> test -> give back.