Database Develop

[DISCUSSION] Are unexploitable bootloaders putting an end to US development?

I will not state the obvious with the exception of this: If you can not root a device much less install a custom recovery, development essentially means absolutely nothing to you.. In this case what is the new definition of open source? "Open source" made android what is today.
All opinions from different perpectives are welcome--but please mind your Ps and Qs.
Thanks....
EDIT: I firmly believe that xda members must be patient. However, there must also be a realistic reckoning. That is to say--hypothetically speaking--if it takes five years to create an exploit, for all practical purposes one could consider that bootloader impregnable considering the exponential pace of technological advancement. So, if one is measured in their assessment and comments, it is closer to the truth and a heck of a lot more useful to talk in terms of "X" device has a bootloader that can not be unlocked. If for example the S4 is "cracked" say--three years from now, will anyone care? Will development restart? Finally, like with any choice, it's up to the individual to decide what can be considered "hard locked." For me, I guessed that the S4 would be leaked an unlock after the S5 came to market. Obviously my reasoning was wrong. At any rate, my ship has sailed--I can be patient no more.
But remember here we are assuming for the sake of a discussion that these bootloaders will not be exploited and if that is the case will that spread to the point that US development dies on the vine.

I thought unlockable bootloaders WERE promoting US development. The T-Mobile S5 subforum is buzzing, and it's crickets around here. It's these locked bootloaders that cause some frustration.

LoSt180 said:
I thought unlockable bootloaders WERE promoting US development. The T-Mobile S5 subforum is buzzing, and it's crickets around here. It's these locked bootloaders that cause some frustration.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think your right about T mobile. But they come with bootloaders that allow rooting and Installation of a custom recovery (I.e. unlocked).. When I say unlockable I am refering to carriers like At&t and Verizon. Take a look at their forums--you can almost hear crickets! As they are "locking down" one might wonder if it will spread especially as a carrier attains its target market share through promotions and even merger.

numbR7 said:
I think your right about T mobile. But they come with bootloaders that allow rooting and Installation of a custom recovery (I.e. unlocked).. When I say unlockable I am refering to carriers like At&t and Verizon. Take a look at their forums--you can almost hear crickets! As they are "locking down" one might wonder if it will spread especially as a carrier attains its target market share through promotions and even merger.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
T-Mobile is unlockable the HTC One M8 is unlockable, AT&T and Verizon S5 variants are not unlockable - we can't unlock them.

Not being able to unlock the bootloader, I believe is going to end development, at least for AT&T and Verizon. If I had the cash, I probably would've went with the T-mobile version, but I'm not rich like that LOL

As it was said by a mod in another thread, giving hopes to users that the AT&T/Verizon's S5 will get root anytime soon is just unfair for the users. It will not happen. The AT&T Note 3 got root when in 4.3, but there is no root in the horizon for KitKat don't even think about an unlocked bootloader. The same happened to the S4 after it was updated the bootloader and root is now lost and that has been for many, many months and on a phone that it had a very large development. Developers are not even bothering on wasting their time on AT&T/Verizon because there is the TMO and International versions available.
So to answer the original question my answer would be Yes.

eortizr said:
As it was said by a mod in another thread, givit helpsng hopes to users that the AT&T/Verizon's S5 will get root anytime soon is just unfair for the users. It will not happen. The AT&T Note 3 got root when in 4.3, but there is no root in the horizon for KitKat don't even think about an unlocked bootloader. The same happened to the S4 after it was updated the bootloader and root is now lost and that has been for many, many months and on a phone that it had a very large development. Developers are not even bothering on wasting their time on AT&T/Verizon because there is the TMO and International versions available.
So to answer the original question my answer would be Yes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I couldn't agree more. I think it's good you emphasize the truth as I helps newer people understand.

eortizr said:
As it was said by a mod in another thread, giving hopes to users that the AT&T/Verizon's S5 will get root anytime soon is just unfair for the users. It will not happen. The AT&T Note 3 got root when in 4.3, but there is no root in the horizon for KitKat don't even think about an unlocked bootloader. The same happened to the S4 after it was updated the bootloader and root is now lost and that has been for many, many months and on a phone that it had a very large development. Developers are not even bothering on wasting their time on AT&T/Verizon because there is the TMO and International versions available.
So to answer the original question my answer would be Yes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is a fine line between giving false hope and nurturing fears, saying "It will not happen" is not necesarily true, it may not happen, but then again remember some who waited for a year to get root or those with iphones who waited for a year to jailbreak.
just my opinion is all.

cstayton said:
There is a fine line between giving false hope and nurturing fears, saying "It will not happen" is not necesarily true, it may not happen, but then again remember some who waited for a year to get root or those with iphones who waited for a year to jailbreak.
just my opinion is all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, when I said 'it will not happen' i was referring to the 'anytime soon' statement.

I agree that saying "it's coming soon" is probably not the best phrase to use. However, to say it will never happen is just as bad. It simply did not and has not happened as fast as we want it to. There is always someone smarter when it comes to computers and software. I am sure the devs have a life outside of hacking a phone for us and everyone needs to be patient. Plus the fact with the Knox security, I am sure the devs want to find all possible work arounds. Just my opinion though...
Sent from my AT&T Samsung Galaxy S5.

What I've come to realize in my years of owning Android devices and reading these posts on xda is that virtually nothing is impossible. However, that is a double-edged sword meaning that the manufacturers have had to step up their collective games to make it even harder for exploits to be found. AT&T and Verizon are protecting themselves from the idiots who don't know what they're doing and brick their devices or get them infected with viruses. I can understand that to a point. However, I would gladly pay AT&T and even sign a waiver to let ME take the risk solely upon myself to do what I would like with MY phone. It's idiots that ruin it for the rest of us. Such as the world, I guess. Just my two cents.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app

I love to use custom Roms etc.However when you buy a phone, buy it for what it is not for what you want it to be later on. The fact that there is no root is what keeps me using my GS4 more than this phone but the S5 is a solid Device, has great battery life (for me at least) and gets everything I need done. Its a matter of being patient especially for any who own the 4 and know how Samsung and ATT locked the previous iteration of this phone.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Premium HD app

baldwyn said:
What I've come to realize in my years of owning Android devices and reading these posts on xda is that virtually nothing is impossible. However, that is a double-edged sword meaning that the manufacturers have had to step up their collective games to make it even harder for exploits to be found. AT&T and Verizon are protecting themselves from the idiots who don't know what they're doing and brick their devices or get them infected with viruses. I can understand that to a point. However, I would gladly pay AT&T and even sign a waiver to let ME take the risk solely upon myself to do what I would like with MY phone. It's idiots that ruin it for the rest of us. Such as the world, I guess. Just my two cents.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please explain how these so-called "idiots" are the reason AT&T and Verizon "had" to lock down the devices. I don't understand.

AT&T and Verizon are protecting themselves from the idiots who don't know what they're doing and brick their devices or get them infected with viruses.
I think I kinda explained it right there.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app[/QUOTE]
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app

baldwyn said:
AT&T and Verizon are protecting themselves from the idiots who don't know what they're doing and brick their devices or get them infected with viruses.
I think I kinda explained it right there.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app[/QUOTE]
Yes - I get that statement. But, how are they protecting themselves. That is, how are they harmed by these "idiots?" Further, if one were to extrapolate users from population, roughly 96% of mobile phone users in the world don't seem to pose a significant problem to thier carriers as it is only the NA carriers that do this ("hard" lock the bootloader). Then, futher hone that to say maybe 1.5%, at the most, US users root their phones. Then narrow further by device. If these numbers are even close--how many of these "idiots" are there. You've been around long enough to know some of the so-called "idiots" were accomplished developers. I do not want to argue with you. I am genuinely intetested in why you see it this way.

rachelm920 said:
Not being able to unlock the bootloader, I believe is going to end development, at least for AT&T and Verizon. If I had the cash, I probably would've went with the T-mobile version, but I'm not rich like that LOL
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you checked into the buyout and trade in promotions T Mobile has? Maybe you can switch with little or no pain. Lol

numbR7 said:
Have you checked into the buyout and trade in promotions T Mobile has? Maybe you can switch with little or no pain. Lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm so god damn sick of this OTA sh... I was at work and it rebooted and started installing by itself. I tried to pop the battery but no matter what I do it continues the installation.
I'm moving to T-Mobile. Thanks ATT!

I'm sorry my off-the-cuff remark has gotten out of hand. The idiots to whom I am referring are the ones who brick their phones or get them infected by lack of knowledge and then try to blame the carrier instead of taking the responsibility themselves. As a precaution, I can see AT&T locking their devices down in an attempt to prevent that from happening. I understand it's a small number of people that cause this or are even affected by this, but by doing so, AT&T can better control their integrity. Same reason why a bag of peanuts sometimes says "Caution: Contains nuts." C.Y.A.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app

baldwyn said:
I'm sorry my off-the-cuff remark has gotten out of hand. The idiots to who. I am referring are the ones who brick their phones or get thefected by lack of knowledge and then try to blame the carrier instead of taking the responsibility themselves. As a precaution, I can see AT&T locking their devices down in an attempt to prevent that from happening. I understand it's a small number of people that cause this or are even affected by this, but by doing so, AT&T can better control their integrity. Same reason why a bag of peanuts sometimes says "Caution: Contains nuts." C.Y.A.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's cool. Posts are often taken wrong or worded differently than someone else is used to talking. I see your point. It makes sense. I may be a little too jaded (to put it nicely) to let them off the hook that easily though. Lol.

After my purchase of the new Samsung galaxy s5 on AT&T I will state that this will be my last carrier specific purchase,
My girlfriend has the HTC M8 (I had one also but hated the freaking pics from the camera).
This was another example of lesson learned, I will from now on purchase nexus devices or not locked to a carrier specific devices, or Google play edition devices from now on.
No more jumping the gun paying full retail to get phones on release day screw that. Lesson has been learned here for sure.
I am thinking on sending my Galaxy S5 into http://www.maxback.com and then purchasing a nexus 5, then later this year when the new nexus is available,I can pick one of them up.. But im kind of stuck as I love the camera on the s5.... this is what is holding me up...
Sure we and disable the bloatware on the Samsung and all that fun stuff, but there is a world of difference when all those items are gone
Thanks to the awesome developers here on XDA making some kickass roms for us.
I run the kingkat on my girlfriends HTC m8 from the HTC forums and it is so much faster with all of the bloatware and features she was never going to use gone.. that m8 is night and day in speed difference and usability..
Bottom line If we are here we have the mindset to tinker and to tinker on these devices WE need to stop buying locked down phones..

Root Concerns

I might be speaking out of an uninformed thought here, but I'm concerned about our root status.
With the bounty being as high as it is, and me not being able to find anywhere that the Devs are collaborating, what are the odds it is taking so long (or even might NOT happen) because there is no developer collaboration for the insanely high bounty? I could be wrong, but I'm starting to wonder if that's the right way to go about it.
Then there's the concern that if we do achieve root, it'll be so late in the game that no one will be developing for our S5 at that point and will have moved on to another device.
Thoughts?

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think we NEED the bootloader unlocked in order to achieve root it just makes it a hell of a lot easier. I believe the Note 3 on certain carriers still has the bootloader locked but someone was able to find a vulnerability and used that to get root. But I do share your concern as many carriers are offering upgrades after a year and most developers and obviously users get new devices with their upgrade.

Correct, we don't need an unlock bootloader to have root, but, Kitkat update has patch all the vulnerabilities that were use in previous devices like the S4 and Note 3, currently all Note3 shipped with KitKat are stock with no root because of that. I personally think that root will not be achieved on the S5 (Verizon and AT&T), the Note 3 has been on the market way longer than the S5 and the bootloader still locked and root is thing of the past if the Device was shipped with KK from factory.
Besides most of the Devs are researchers and get better recognition/$$$ by giving the exploits to manufactures instead of making it public. Other Devs just like to make it for Fun, but with the locked bootloader there is not much fun but a lot of work instead, and since no everybody that pledges actually pays is not worth it for them to actually work on getting root for a device you can get unlocked on other networks (ex. T-Mo). If all S5 were to be shipped with a locked bootloader, you would had root by now.

Colerunn said:
I might be speaking out of an uninformed thought here, but I'm concerned about our root status.
With the bounty being as high as it is, and me not being able to find anywhere that the Devs are collaborating, what are the odds it is taking so long (or even might NOT happen) because there is no developer collaboration for the insanely high bounty? I could be wrong, but I'm starting to wonder if that's the right way to go about it.
Then there's the concern that if we do achieve root, it'll be so late in the game that no one will be developing for our S5 at that point and will have moved on to another device.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These are legitimate concerns that should have you reevaluating your next purchase based on carrier and manufacturer. The goal is to make AT&T and Verizon phones secure enough for the military and business accounts. That is where the big bucks lie for those carriers. Sprint and T-mobile are more geared towards the average pedestrian with their lower price plans and limited coverage, therefore do not worry about locked bootloaders and super secure phones. Other manufacturers such as HTC provide unlock to those seeking it and root has been very easy.
As for developer discussions regarding root...you have seen what the bounty threads turn into...with all that bickering and name calling it is not conducive to a development environment, so those people actually hampered progress. I am sure discussions are going on in private in some IRC channel without the needless interruptions and constant requests for ETA and "Are we there yet." And as mentioned there is a lot more $$$ in the private sectors rather than claim a half bounty and have a free root available.

I'm really regretting my purchase of the S5 without having root, and to hear that it may never come is really concerning.

Welp, sounds like it's time for me to bite the bullet then. I'm thinking I'll post my phone to Craigslist as looking to sell or trade for a T-mobile version. Worse-comes-to-worst, I'll ebay the phone for what I can get, and pay out of pocket the difference for a new one.
Raises a new question: international version or just a different U.S. carrier's?

The carriers are getting work and ideas from us, then adding those features to the phones. Then locking them up (Bootloaders, No Root) because - Like Kenny says, they want to be more secure for corporations. Some people use root for bad things like (Not paying for apps and Xposed modules blocking ads, and other things that they don't want us doing) I use root for LONG LASTING BATTERY LIFE and getting rid of bloatware apps running in the background I dont even use. Yes, it sucks we can't do the things we use to but, they have made it so we can Turn Off apps, Long Lasting battery with the Ultra Power Save feature, etc......(Things we did with root are now coming on the phone >Stole those ideas from us<
EDIT: LETS GO KINGO, YOU CAN DO IT !!!!!! Maybe soon Kingo can produce a root option. That would be awesome. I'm not leaving At&t, been there for 18 years. Great coverage and customer service has been awesome to me !!!

Don't need root for getting apps for free. Ever heard of Aptoide?
Sent from my stock, untouched Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 7.0 on the xda-developers app

LoopingCreeper said:
Don't need root for getting apps for free. Ever heard of Aptoide?
Sent from my stock, untouched Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 7.0 on the xda-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, you know what I mean. They don't want us to have Root Access. You can do a lot of things with root man.

LuckyColdJohnson said:
Well, you know what I mean. They don't want us to have Root Access. You can do a lot of things with root man.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know what your mean. Freedom can be used to get in app purchaces for free. That is kinda getting apps for free and it requires root.
Sent from my stock, untouched Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 7.0 on the xda-developers app

For me, ans more of a power user, the Root abilities were to get a smooother better battery life custom solution. I used Adaway and some apps for better performance. Other than that, root didnt mean much to me. I do miss the rebel aspect of it and that alone rather makes me wish I had bought the HTC M8 instead of the S5 last week.
Best of luck to the Devs that find us a root or AT&T to provide unlocking.

I'm with you guys. I'm just out to up my battery life, remove ads (admittedly. Can you blame me?), and have a few hardware changes, like reassigning buttons, switching music with my volume keys and such.
Biggest want? Titanium backup. I relied on that app more than I'd like to admit, as well as TWRP or ClockWork (depending on the phone/ROM I was using at the time).
It's just nice to be free with something I bought full price, SO I COULD HAVE THE FREEDOM TO DO WHAT I WANTED WITH IT.
Either way, We'll see what happens. All I want is root permissions.
Here's a curious thought, though. The AT&T S4 isn't rooted, but they have a workaround (loki mod). Anyone know if something like that is in the works for us?

I agree. Hopefully we will get an Root option (Maybe Kingo will come through again like with the Note 3) but their saying nobody has a root option for 4.4 on At&t phones. Don't see much talk about almost getting there as well. Chainfire was also saying that new Android firmware is about to start breaking root apps. 4.4.3 and on could be the start to the end of custom roms and root for Samsung devices (At&t). I too thought about going with an HTC device, I just love the S5's camera. I don't know what to think about these new phones man. It was so much fun installing and customizing our phones how we wanted to. Its sad and depressing watching these loved things go away. I'm not on my phone as much anymore.

I'm personally getting ready to purchase another device, I love my GS5 even tho it isn't rooted but I'm just not liking the size of it. I got it for $10 with my team member discount but I think I'm going to either get a T-Mobile one or European S5. Idk I want to stay with Samsung but this whole locked phone thing is discouraging.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using XDA Premium HD app

LuckyColdJohnson said:
I agree. Hopefully we will get an Root option (Maybe Kingo will come through again like with the Note 3) but their saying nobody has a root option for 4.4 on At&t phones. Don't see much talk about almost getting there as well. Chainfire was also saying that new Android firmware is about to start breaking root apps. 4.4.3 and on could be the start to the end of custom roms and root for Samsung devices (At&t). I too thought about going with an HTC device, I just love the S5's camera. I don't know what to think about these new phones man. It was so much fun installing and customizing our phones how we wanted to. Its sad and depressing watching these loved things go away. I'm not on my phone as much anymore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the only reason I kept and probably will keep my Nexus 5...

Colerunn said:
I might be speaking out of an uninformed thought here, but I'm concerned about our root status.
With the bounty being as high as it is, and me not being able to find anywhere that the Devs are collaborating, what are the odds it is taking so long (or even might NOT happen) because there is no developer collaboration for the insanely high bounty? I could be wrong, but I'm starting to wonder if that's the right way to go about it.
Then there's the concern that if we do achieve root, it'll be so late in the game that no one will be developing for our S5 at that point and will have moved on to another device.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've seen maybe one or two times since I've been a member of XDA where a bounty worked achieve root or an unlocked bootloader. Honestly, I doubt many of the devs who work on that type of stuff bought an AT&T S5. If it was me, I would have gone T-Mobile or International, as I'm sure most have.
Also, as someone said above, not everyone pays their pledges. The longer a bounty lasts, the bigger chance people who have pledged early have moved on or are not following anymore. I'm willing to bet that if a bounty was close to 2K, the most a dev could hope for is maybe $500, if their lucky. That's still quite a bit of money, but no where near what was pledged. Past experiences dictate present actions.
Sent from my VK810 4G using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
---------- Post added at 04:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:05 AM ----------
KennyG123 said:
These are legitimate concerns that should have you reevaluating your next purchase based on carrier and manufacturer. The goal is to make AT&T and Verizon phones secure enough for the military and business accounts. That is where the big bucks lie for those carriers. Sprint and T-mobile are more geared towards the average pedestrian with their lower price plans and limited coverage, therefore do not worry about locked bootloaders and super secure phones. Other manufacturers such as HTC provide unlock to those seeking it and root has been very easy.
As for developer discussions regarding root...you have seen what the bounty threads turn into...with all that bickering and name calling it is not conducive to a development environment, so those people actually hampered progress. I am sure discussions are going on in private in some IRC channel without the needless interruptions and constant requests for ETA and "Are we there yet." And as mentioned there is a lot more $$$ in the private sectors rather than claim a half bounty and have a free root available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The carriers should make separate phones for consumers and businesses. That would be great.
Sent from my VK810 4G using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Skizzy034 said:
The carriers should make separate phones for consumers and businesses. That would be great.
Sent from my VK810 4G using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some do...sort of...they are called developer's editions and you usually have to wait a few months for their release.

KennyG123 said:
Some do...sort of...they are called developer's editions and you usually have to wait a few months for their release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey KennyG, I just got the s5 Active, will y'all be opening up a thread for that soon? Thanks

Colerunn said:
Welp, sounds like it's time for me to bite the bullet then. I'm thinking I'll post my phone to Craigslist as looking to sell or trade for a T-mobile version. Worse-comes-to-worst, I'll ebay the phone for what I can get, and pay out of pocket the difference for a new one.
Raises a new question: international version or just a different U.S. carrier's?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MetroPCS S5 for $649+ $30 unlock code from cellunlocker-dot-net and you have a wide open west device ready for custom recovery/roms, the works. Also will be carrier unlocked and completely unbranded. Radio has all the LTE bands for TMO and ATT, LTE works. Was using Alliance Rom at the time.
I did sell mine and picked up an M8. Just prefer the feel in hand, 32GB (what was SEC thinking 16GB on a top tier device!) and of course the IPS LCD just looks better to my old, tired eyes than the SuperAMOLED+. Of course everyone's preferences are different.
If you're a night owl and prefer full darkness viewing the AMOLED displays can't be beat. Using LUX I was able to turn down the brightness to just about nothing and the contrast is still outstanding. LCDs (of course) wash out since they do have finite limits of contrast at low levels...
But in normal environments, wow, the IPS display looks spectacular...
In any case, expecting root on an ATT device these days is probably going to lead to major disappointment. Personally, I'd rather use an iOS device than a locked bootloader device (S4/S5).
When you're used to having the freedom of root and can no longer do the things you get used to it's like a punishment, having virtual shackles around your feet and expected to run a 10K on a day with 80 degree dewpoints. Oh yes and with a family of hungry black bears right behind you...

LuckyColdJohnson said:
Hey KennyG, I just got the s5 Active, will y'all be opening up a thread for that soon? Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really needed if it is just as locked down and basically same hardware will see how it goes.

Conflicted

I've been reading the several threads on this forum, and on the regular Verizon S6 forum, yet still remain on the fence about forking over a large sum of money for this device. Forgive me for my rambling but any thoughts on this would be appreciated.
I've been using smartphones since 2007, starting with my windows mobile XV6800 (htc). Been tinkering with them, and unlocking my phones even before Android devices were available. Touch Pro II, Dinc, Tbolt, GSIII, and now HTC one (m7) Of all these phones, by far, the GSIII was my favorite. It had such great dev support, and root/bootloader unlock was achieved within a few months of it being out. M7 was a bit of a hassle to root, and gain S-off, but still doable. But now, all I am reading is that it is very likely GS6 will never get rooted (at least us poor saps on Verizon). Another caveat: I still have unlimited data, and have been paying full price for my phones since GSIII so don't want to make an impulsive purchase by any means. So my question is this: given the technology that is available now, is there any advantage to unlocking this phone other than flashing cleaner debloated ROMS, or custom kernels? The WiFi tether can be accomplished via FoxFi, and there is a working debloat tool floating around. For some reason, I cannot wrap my head around paying a large sum of money for a device and not being able to modify it to my liking. Considering other phones such as M9, or LGG4, that might be more rootable but I'm just not feeling the coolness factor on those as much as GS6.
What I remember about the GS3 is that root was achieved before the bootloader unlock. It took quite a bit of time but eventually we were able to flash an unencrypted aboot.img to the appropriate partition when it was leaked by an insider, and voila, we were unlocked. I'm assuming that resource is not available to us anymore.
I'd love to hear some opinions on this from other flashaholics that have taken the leap and gone with this locked down device.

morrowa2 said:
I've been reading the several threads on this forum, and on the regular Verizon S6 forum, yet still remain on the fence about forking over a large sum of money for this device. Forgive me for my rambling but any thoughts on this would be appreciated.
I've been using smartphones since 2007, starting with my windows mobile XV6800 (htc). Been tinkering with them, and unlocking my phones even before Android devices were available. Touch Pro II, Dinc, Tbolt, GSIII, and now HTC one (m7) Of all these phones, by far, the GSIII was my favorite. It had such great dev support, and root/bootloader unlock was achieved within a few months of it being out. M7 was a bit of a hassle to root, and gain S-off, but still doable. But now, all I am reading is that it is very likely GS6 will never get rooted (at least us poor saps on Verizon). Another caveat: I still have unlimited data, and have been paying full price for my phones since GSIII so don't want to make an impulsive purchase by any means. So my question is this: given the technology that is available now, is there any advantage to unlocking this phone other than flashing cleaner debloated ROMS, or custom kernels? The WiFi tether can be accomplished via FoxFi, and there is a working debloat tool floating around. For some reason, I cannot wrap my head around paying a large sum of money for a device and not being able to modify it to my liking. Considering other phones such as M9, or LGG4, that might be more rootable but I'm just not feeling the coolness factor on those as much as GS6.
What I remember about the GS3 is that root was achieved before the bootloader unlock. It took quite a bit of time but eventually we were able to flash an unencrypted aboot.img to the appropriate partition when it was leaked by an insider, and voila, we were unlocked. I'm assuming that resource is not available to us anymore.
I'd love to hear some opinions on this from other flashaholics that have taken the leap and gone with this locked down device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have had quite a number of phones (as you can see from my signature lol) and flashed more than you see there. I enjoy toying around and changing to my liking. With that being said, I went and got this device because I loved the edges and the look. I think the themes that Samsung has allowed give you some of that customization ability. Though you can't uninstall apps or alter some things, Idk, there was just something about it I loved.
I don't think we are going to see an unlocked bootloader anytime soon, or a root either, but it's still a great device in my eyes.
Sent from my SM-G925V using XDA Free mobile app

eorsini said:
I have had quite a number of phones (as you can see from my signature lol) and flashed more than you see there. I enjoy toying around and changing to my liking. With that being said, I went and got this device because I loved the edges and the look. I think the themes that Samsung has allowed give you some of that customization ability. Though you can't uninstall apps or alter some things, Idk, there was just something about it I loved.
I don't think we are going to see an unlocked bootloader anytime soon, or a root either, but it's still a great device in my eyes.
Sent from my SM-G925V using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! That's the direction I'm leaning.

I always say if you are conflicted, then the answer is no. Pretty much always.

JasonJoel said:
I always say if you are conflicted, then the answer is no. Pretty much always.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Life isn't about being safe and reserved, it's about throwing yourself out there, getting banged up, and then doing it all over again.
I say, if you're conflicted, then go for it... It's always better to have learned from an experience than to say 'what if' or 'I should've'...
Yeah it's cash but so what, the biggest risk here is disappointment; you can always sell the device.
*If you want an example, ask me about the time while on vacation I got stranded in Reno after someone stole the entire contents of my bank account... So with no money, gear, or a plan, I decided to hitchhike to Burning Man with an Irishman, an Mexican and a polyamorous Swiss couple I met at a grocery store. I can assure you good times were had and yes... At the beginning I was most assuredly conflicted.

Could not disagree more. But whatever, I don't really care of he buys an S6 or not. Lol

I'm open to all opinions here. I'm currently on m7 and I abhor the stock software, while the latest aosp ROMs have been incredibly buggy. Just itchy to get a new phone that is actually functional. Thanks for the advice.
Sent from my One using XDA Free mobile app

I don't know if this is the best phone I've ever had but it's by fast the best Samsung device I've ever had. Go for it!

I posted earlier but wanted to give an update:
After 2 weeks this is definitely the best Samsung Galaxy I've ever had. It's fast, responsive, and I still oogle the screen and it's curves. I don't even think about rooting or anything because with the themes and Nova Launcher it's a whole new phone. My battery is actually really good too which is just another bonus. I say try it if you are conflicted. Worst case you can return it on the 13th day and you only lose a little money.
Sent from my SM-G925V using XDA Free mobile app

I came from some rooted stuff myself, but aside from a few things that I had on my Galaxy Nexus with Sourcery ROM, the main advantage that root gave me was the tethering. FoxFi solved that on the Edge. If I want to change up the look on my phone, I can throw another launcher on whenever, icon packs, etc, and none of those require root. So I was also sitting on the fence until launch, and then it dawned on me ... what would root REALLY give me, that I can't find a workaround not anyway? Do I want root just for the sake of being able to? Sure there are still some apps you can't take off altogether, but with the 64g version, I'm not going to see a huge chunk of space taken out by them, and with a 3rd party launcher, I can just hide them altogether. That's actually the only main complaint about stock, is that I can't hide them in the stock drawer.
All that said, I'm VERY happy with the phone as it sits. Such an improvement over my G2 (which was still a great phone for me til the day I traded in), that giving up root options (at least for now, even if forever) was a trade-off well worth taking.

Thanks for all the feedback. I broke down and ordered the 128 GB model in black. Trading in my old smartphones will help with the cost. They said I'll receive it on Friday ☺
Sent from my One using XDA Free mobile app

morrowa2 said:
Thanks for all the feedback. I broke down and ordered the 128 GB model in black. Trading in my old smartphones will help with the cost. They said I'll receive it on Friday ☺
Sent from my One using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good deal man. Hope you like it as much as I do.
Sent from my SM-G925V using XDA Free mobile app

morrowa2 said:
Thanks for all the feedback. I broke down and ordered the 128 GB model in black. Trading in my old smartphones will help with the cost. They said I'll receive it on Friday ☺
Sent from my One using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You made a good choice, as far as I'm concerned. I've been crash flashing a hell of a lot longer than my "joined xda" date would lead you to believe, and while I will ALWAYS miss the days of uninhibited GS3 flashing and I found myself doing it less and less as phones got better.
That being said, I still want root - and will still hold out hope that we'll get it. I imagine we will, but it will be a while and I think it's important for all of us to temper our expectations when it comes to that. Just enjoy this beautiful, unique device and try not to let it get you down.
Not to mention there's still plenty of new(er) devices (tablets, phones, etc) that can and will always be unlockable/rootable ... so you can get your kicks with them while you wait!
Welcome to the GS6E family!

Root is dead

tiny70thomas said:
Root is dead
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not according to this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=60546194
Sent from my One using XDA Free mobile app

[Q] Anything being done?

I have a galaxy s5 from AT&T that I got with a new two year contract. It has version 5.0 on it and came that way. I know that it's not rootable atm but just curious if there's anywhere with progress.

morgan5814 said:
I have a galaxy s5 from AT&T that I got with a new two year contract. It has version 5.0 on it and came that way. I know that it's not rootable atm but just curious if there's anywhere with progress.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please review the history of the site. Root is not root until it is root...meaning you cannot ask "are we there yet?" When full root is achieved it will be posted. Work is often done by developers off of XDA because it is the only way they can work uninterrupted. Any progress to get system access like some root methods that were lost upon reboot..cannot be determined whether or not you are close...until it is fully working and tested. The security of Lollipop, AT&T locked bootloaders and knox are a lot of hurdles to leap over.

Yes, however I think a better wording, with the s6 will there even be people bothering with it?

morgan5814 said:
Yes, however I think a better wording, with the s6 will there even be people bothering with it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope so. I'm in the same crowd of people that do not have to have the latest and greatest. The S6, while its an impressive device...without a replaceable battery....I just dont think it will have the staying power (pun intended) or durability for a device that a user might keep for a year or 2. The characteristics of the S6 itself (unfortunately) lends itself more to a throw-away device after its new and shiny wears out and the next iteration of the Galaxy line becomes available. There are ALOT of GS5s out there....and quite literally...ATT is giving them away.
Thats JMHO...YMMV.

morgan5814 said:
Yes, however I think a better wording, with the s6 will there even be people bothering with it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think so. There are some things improved on the S6, but there are also some steps backward from what we have on the S5. I'm sure educated buyers will weigh those pros and cons very carefully and some buyers will decide that the S5 is better suited for their needs and tastes.
I personally know only one person who upgraded from an S5 to an S6 and he wants to go back to his S5.

Boot loader unlock bounty

I would pledge $20 towards a BL unlock or an exploit like on the MDK S4 for the AT&T s6 and s6 edge.
Anyone know of an existing bounty?
Sent from my SM-G925A using XDA Premium HD app

justda said:
I would pledge $20 towards a BL unlock or an exploit like on the MDK S4 for the AT&T s6 and s6 edge.
Anyone know of an existing bounty?
Sent from my SM-G925A using XDA Premium HD app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My guess since no one has unlocked the bootloaders since the S3 updates, then S4, S5, Note 4....many with bounties there, that it is pointless to make another. I believe the assumption is the bootloader lock is similar for them all.

Even if you put $20 million on it, there is no hope.
来自我的 SAMSUNG-SM-G890A 上的 Tapatalk

ericzhf said:
Even if you put $20 million on it, there is no hope.
来自我的 SAMSUNG-SM-G890A 上的 Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you put 20 million in it the carrier may view that as a solid business case to release it themselves.

Without doomcalling...but it feels like XDA is going the way of the dinosaur with respect to carrier phones. With improved general experience, and a tightly locked bootloader, what's there left to do?
I felt so much more into my htc ThunderBolt...we even got important upgrades, like ice cream sandwich, before the masses at Verizon. I wish we could have those days again, but with a more powerful device. I'm still using my S4, which I rooted, then had to unroot due to a faulty charging port warranty claim. I never bothered to re-root...
As a long time PC gamer, it's disheartening to see our devices going this way. The smartphone is essentially the successor to the PC in a lot of ways for many people. And we accept things so hideously controlled...it's like buying a PC with tons of unremovable spyware baked in.
I'd love to see this bootloader cracked. But it's right up there on the list next to restoring our privacy and freedoms...

Dannar said:
Without doomcalling...but it feels like XDA is going the way of the dinosaur with respect to carrier phones. With improved general experience, and a tightly locked bootloader, what's there left to do?
I felt so much more into my htc ThunderBolt...we even got important upgrades, like ice cream sandwich, before the masses at Verizon. I wish we could have those days again, but with a more powerful device. I'm still using my S4, which I rooted, then had to unroot due to a faulty charging port warranty claim. I never bothered to re-root...
As a long time PC gamer, it's disheartening to see our devices going this way. The smartphone is essentially the successor to the PC in a lot of ways for many people. And we accept things so hideously controlled...it's like buying a PC with tons of unremovable spyware baked in.
I'd love to see this bootloader cracked. But it's right up there on the list next to restoring our privacy and freedoms...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel the same way. Back in the days of the HTC Aria And SGS2 it was quite a different experience. Even the LG Optimus G had some cool stuff going on with it being almost an N4 clone, even though it had a relatively small dev community.

Dannar said:
Without doomcalling...but it feels like XDA is going the way of the dinosaur with respect to carrier phones. With improved general experience, and a tightly locked bootloader, what's there left to do?
I felt so much more into my htc ThunderBolt...we even got important upgrades, like ice cream sandwich, before the masses at Verizon. I wish we could have those days again, but with a more powerful device. I'm still using my S4, which I rooted, then had to unroot due to a faulty charging port warranty claim. I never bothered to re-root...
As a long time PC gamer, it's disheartening to see our devices going this way. The smartphone is essentially the successor to the PC in a lot of ways for many people. And we accept things so hideously controlled...it's like buying a PC with tons of unremovable spyware baked in.
I'd love to see this bootloader cracked. But it's right up there on the list next to restoring our privacy and freedoms...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt XDA will become a pool of oil beneath the Earth :silly: but there are major differences between now and "back then." Back then there were lots of leaks and bits of info that got you tars before they were released. Back then XDA had maybe 1 million members, now closing towards 7 million. XDA became popular, carriers started sending in spies as well as manufacturers, plus breakthroughs and leaks here are plastered on front pages of other phone sites. The carriers have tightened security on their leaks. Samsung, Google, etc have hired those known to crack bootloaders and root to prevent anyone else from being able to do it. "We" at XDA are becoming more diverse with more and more premium smart phones being released quarterly. Back then every carrier didn't have a version of the same phone...it trickled with the Note and S2, but blew up to all carriers with the S3 and Note 2. Now with Xposed and root you can do a lot of the things yourself you wanted in custom ROMs..so the developers took another hit on being able to bring things to you that no one else can.
Sorry if I seem like I am rambling on...too much coffee already
Hopefully the next generation of Chainfire, Jcase, Beaups, Geohot....shows up soon with things that can bring back strong development.