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Why 1080P on a 5" LCD panel?

Hi
I've been objectively comparing the display on the Nexus 4 and Nexus 5 side by side and really question why we have 1080P screens on such small displays. Are we all so gullible we take in the marketing and believe more must be better?
Ignoring any arguments about better colors or contrast between the two phones, which have nothing to do with resolution, and that in my case the Nexus 4 looks little different from the Nexus 5 in color and contrast anyway, what about differences the extra resolution and slightly larger diagonal make?
Personally, I fail to see any differences in day to day use, even looking close up everything looks equal on both displays. Yes if I look very closely, closer than I would ever use the device in day to day use, I can just make out the pixel structure on the Nexus 4 where on the Nexus 5 I can't.
So what about the larger screen size? Well we get an extra 6mm approximately in height on the Nexus 5, the width is the same. This extra height has nothing to do with the greater resolution, but is caused by using non-square pixels on the Nexus 4. The aspect ratio of these displays should be 1.777 (1920/1080 or 1280/720 is 1.777). The Nexus 4 aspect ratio is 1.64, so was squashed vertically, the Nexus 5 is 1.78 so the correct aspect ratio. All they have done with the Nexus 5 is given it the correct aspect ratio, hence the extra 6mm in height and the resulting slightly larger diagonal. This could equally have been achieved using 1280x720.
Because we haven't really got a bigger display in the Nexus 5, just a correction of the aspect ratio (hence the width is the same on both), the screen doesn't really show any more information than the Nexus 4. As the display is now thinner compared to the Nexus 4 and due to the Nexus 5 setup, web pages with text will often wrap to the next line sooner than on the Nexus 4, so ironically with the Nexus 5 you may have less shown vertically than the Nexus 4. Sometimes other webpages will suit the taller Nexus 5 a bit better so you get a bit more in, overall though, it's swings and roundabouts.
What 1080P does provide is a faster draining battery as the back light needs to be more powerful to give the same visible brightness than a lower resolution display, and the graphics processor also needs to work much harder with all those extra pixels draining even more battery, that is never good in a phone. Wouldn't it be preferable for a 720P display that is less battery hungry and the R&D invested in better image quality rather than more pixels we can barely discern in such a small area?
So to sum up, what we have here in my opinion is just marketing. LCD phone panels are suffering the same marketing as mega pixels in cameras. Because the manufactures can provide LCD panels with ever growing pixel densities without too much extra cost, they are doing, as bigger numbers sell better and encourage us to replace perfectly good devices.
So for anyone considering the Nexus 5 to replace the Nexus 4 because they consider the larger screen will make the phone better to use for reading web pages etc, after all, the numbers of 1920x1080 compared to 1280x720 are compelling, in reality I'm not sure many people will notice a difference.
Regards
Phil

PhilipL said:
Why 1080P on a 5" LCD panel?
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Click to collapse
Simple: because we can.
And within 2 years we'll see 4K resolutions on such small panels as well so this is just scratching the surface (no pun intended) of hand-held touch-operated display technologies.

The only thing I could practically see as useful is being able to display more content on the screen due to DPI scaling. Even still, I don't think it would be significant enough for the tradeoff of battery drain. And it is less than ideal managing a lot of content on such a small screen.
Maybe as video resolution increases, the displays will be able to offer a slight benefit with a higher resolution (beyond 1080p), however pointless it may be. Perhaps phones with video output could benefit by having a higher resolution being able to be displayed on a much larger screen? I am not sure if this is software or hardware dependent so it could be a null point.
Other than that, I suppose they are available because it is possible. As technology advances, more powerful hardware is needed to support/benefit from it and innovation and all that stuff follows leading to more advanced technology.
So if we do end up going beyond 1080p for phones, there is a chance that it will require other related resources to improve in order for it to be useful. I could see breakthroughs in battery life or efficiency being made to support whatever ridiculous and unnecessary resolution display that may be created.
Sorry if what I said irks anybody for whatever reason, just my opinion of the current situation with phones and HD displays so let's all just be happy
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

I personally think it's noticeably sharper than my Nexus 4
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Just because you can't notice a difference does not mean you can speak for everyone.

5" is the borderline between 720p and 1080p. You can definitely notice the difference at 5.3", 5.5", 5.7", 6" etc., and most of us can see, albeit barely, the difference at 5", so why not get the 1080p goodie?
There are at least 2 benefits: subpixels are much more crowded so there are smaller gaps between them making a larger % of the screen covered (it makes a big difference!), plus no matter if you actually notice the difference, sharper image and more detailed text is more relaxing for your eyes to read.
I guess we could live with a 5" 720p screen, but the good news is: whatever technology debuted some 6 months ago, the Nexus line-up will get it for cheap. So the question is not why 1080p on a 5" LCD panel... but why not?

Because the 720p is awful right now I'll see the difference in a lot of things. Like images, text, internet pages, icons.

I thought the same thing at first, but looking at the screen, it's much sharper than the Nexus 4, especially when it comes to reading. The new thing roboto font complements the resolution perfectly.

BoneXDA said:
5" is the borderline between 720p and 1080p. You can definitely notice the difference at 5.3", 5.5", 5.7", 6" etc., and most of us can see, albeit barely, the difference at 5", so why not get the 1080p goodie?
There are at least 2 benefits: subpixels are much more crowded so there are smaller gaps between them making a larger % of the screen covered (it makes a big difference!), plus no matter if you actually notice the difference, sharper image and more detailed text is more relaxing for your eyes to read.
I guess we could live with a 5" 720p screen, but the good news is: whatever technology debuted some 6 months ago, the Nexus line-up will get it for cheap. So the question is not why 1080p on a 5" LCD panel... but why not?
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Click to collapse
The "why not", is fairly easy, battery life. As you said the difference in quality is borderline. All of those saying there is a massive difference, well science disagrees with you. What your eye can actually see is defined for the standard 20/20 vision. There is a definitely "shinny new" element, which in many does overpower the science behind what and eye can actually see. It's sort of the same argument for 4k TVs. View distance is key in both.

SykesAT said:
The "why not", is fairly easy, battery life. As you said the difference in quality is borderline. All of those saying there is a massive difference, well science disagrees with you. What your eye can actually see is defined for the standard 20/20 vision. There is a definitely "shinny new" element, which in many does overpower the science behind what and eye can actually see. It's sort of the same argument for 4k TVs. View distance is key in both.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Experience very much shows that higher resolution screen does NOT result in higher battery drain. Relative to battery capacity, the Galaxy S4's bigger and higher res screen is far more efficient that the S3's, same goes for the HTC One to One X, LG G2 to Optimus G, and the Nexus 5 does better video playback than the Nexus 4 as well (this is the least CPU-dependant testing that tells the most about the screen). This is because like SoCs, AMOLED and LCD technology also evolved in efficiency.

BoneXDA said:
Experience very much shows that higher resolution screen does NOT result in higher battery drain. Relative to battery capacity, the Galaxy S4's bigger and higher res screen is far more efficient that the S3's, same goes for the HTC One to One X, LG G2 to Optimus G, and the Nexus 5 does better video playback than the Nexus 4 as well (this is the least CPU-dependant testing that tells the most about the screen). This is because like SoCs, AMOLED and LCD technology also evolved in efficiency.
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Click to collapse
agreed, technology has evolved and become more efficient, but that does not address the power needs of the same gen tech when looking at 720p vs 1080p, nor viewing distances.

Hi
BoneXDA said:
5" is the borderline between 720p and 1080p. You can definitely notice the difference at 5.3", 5.5", 5.7", 6" etc., and most of us can see, albeit barely, the difference at 5", so why not get the 1080p goodie?
There are at least 2 benefits: subpixels are much more crowded so there are smaller gaps between them making a larger % of the screen covered (it makes a big difference!), plus no matter if you actually notice the difference, sharper image and more detailed text is more relaxing for your eyes to read.
I guess we could live with a 5" 720p screen, but the good news is: whatever technology debuted some 6 months ago, the Nexus line-up will get it for cheap. So the question is not why 1080p on a 5" LCD panel... but why not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not get a 1080P panel, battery life perhaps and better quality 720P? The problem with all those pixels is you have loads of extra transistors and wiring on the display, all that means less of the display is being used to transmit light. If they take the same lithography, i.e. smaller transistors and wires that are required to pack in 1920x1080 to a 5" inch display to a 720P 5" panel, so no gaps and more screen area transmissible to light, it would use less power to back light than 720P displays have used before and would look better and brighter for less battery power than an equivalent 1080P display.
Of course we will get 2k displays or even 4k displays on 5" diagonals, then what will happen is what is happening to mobile phone cameras, it will come a point where they can't add any more pixels (with mobile phone cameras they are down to only measuring a few photons at at time in each pixel hence you get very noisy pictures in poor light), so the next marketing trick to sell to us will be as HTC have done with their cameras, reduce the numbers then tell us that the lower number of pixels were all along better.
By the time most people have covered the display with smudges and dust during normal day to day use, they are not going to notice the difference between a 5" display at 720p and 1080p at normal viewing distances. I've had friends fail to notice the difference between 720P and 1080P on the Nexus 7 with a 7" display let alone a 5" one. One friend actually preferred the 720P panel as he said text looked more like a good computer monitor display and was easier to read!
Don't get me wrong I like the Nexus 5, but think it would have been better with longer battery life and a brighter and better display that would have been available using the same new LCD technology but in a 720P panel. This would also give better manufacturing yields, and so reduce the price of display, with the savings going towards better calibration and consistent displays between devices. There is already a thread about poor quality control with very warm yellow displays on some Nexus 5's yet another Nexus 5 sat next to it is bright white looking completely difference. So much for the benefits of 1080P when no two phones are guaranteed to look the same.
Regards
Phil

Today's 1080 smartphone displays typically use less power overall than the last generation models with 720 displays, believe it or not. Note when I'm saying this I'm leaning more towards the actual display tech itself and not the backlight: when you account for the power requirements of the panel itself (not counting the draw from the backlight) the 1080 panel on the Nexus 5 pulls less current than the 720 on the Nexus 4 (which is more accurately 1280x768 so it's technically a bit more pixels)
The backlight remains the largest draw of current in a smartphone today in typical usage - it's only when you begin to max out the CPU+GPU at the same time will that really begin to sway favor away from the backlight itself.
If I honestly had my choice, I'd have SuperAMOLED(+) tech in every device but the issue there is a) it tends to wash out in direct sunlight (not that I can't cover the device with my hand or something and see it and b) AMOLED dies over time since the organic aspects literally just wear out.
LCDs are still pretty nice in my opinion, and they get the job done just fine, but it sure would be nice to find a way to do a proper backlight that actually get the job done without that massive power requirement that remains attached to that technology even today.
Also, 720p and 1080p are technically video formats, but people just keep right on referring to them as resolutions...

PhilipL said:
Hi
Why not get a 1080P panel, battery life perhaps and better quality 720P? The problem with all those pixels is you have loads of extra transistors and wiring on the display, all that means less of the display is being used to transmit light. If they take the same lithography, i.e. smaller transistors and wires that are required to pack in 1920x1080 to a 5" inch display to a 720P 5" panel, so no gaps and more screen area transmissible to light, it would use less power to back light than 720P displays have used before and would look better and brighter for less battery power than an equivalent 1080P display.
Of course we will get 2k displays or even 4k displays on 5" diagonals, then what will happen is what is happening to mobile phone cameras, it will come a point where they can't add any more pixels (with mobile phone cameras they are down to only measuring a few photons at at time in each pixel hence you get very noisy pictures in poor light), so the next marketing trick to sell to us will be as HTC have done with their cameras, reduce the numbers then tell us that the lower number of pixels were all along better.
By the time most people have covered the display with smudges and dust during normal day to day use, they are not going to notice the difference between a 5" display at 720p and 1080p at normal viewing distances. I've had friends fail to notice the difference between 720P and 1080P on the Nexus 7 with a 7" display let alone a 5" one. One friend actually preferred the 720P panel as he said text looked more like a good computer monitor display and was easier to read!
Don't get me wrong I like the Nexus 5, but think it would have been better with longer battery life and a brighter and better display that would have been available using the same new LCD technology but in a 720P panel. This would also give better manufacturing yields, and so reduce the price of display, with the savings going towards better calibration and consistent displays between devices. There is already a thread about poor quality control with very warm yellow displays on some Nexus 5's yet another Nexus 5 sat next to it is bright white looking completely difference. So much for the benefits of 1080P when no two phones are guaranteed to look the same.
Regards
Phil
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read my post above. The Nexus 5 screen is not just higher res, it's brighter, more accurate AND more efficient, therefore it's clearly producing better user experience. Your friend has his opinion, but he'll find very few he'd agree that the Nexus 4's 720p screen beats the Nexus 5's 1080p, and that's the comparison that matters since the 5 is replacing the 4.
The Nexus 5's battery problem comes from the battery itself: at an ever so slightly thicker frame the G2 and Droid MAXX managed to pack in 3000mAh+, too bad Google didn't go for that. But the 5 has still better battery life than the 4, and the 1080p still has better efficiency.
Also, are you really complaining about the price of the 1080p display... on a $350 high-end flagship phone?

because 'murica
thats all, we dont need more than 720p in less than 7", its inperceptible.. but yes we can.

Most people got the phone for the Qualcomm 800 CPU. What does this do? It measures the amount of energy the phone is asking for and makes it as efficient as possible for the phone. Works similarly then you see in a V-Tec or Eco-tec transmission in cars. Also, you gave a lot of opinions in your post, when, you said it would be purely objective. That would make it subjective. *note I didn't say purely subjective, because you did put in some data (objective) results.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app

PhilipL said:
Hi
I've been objectively comparing the display on the Nexus 4 and Nexus 5 side by side and really question why we have 1080P screens on such small displays. Are we all so gullible we take in the marketing and believe more must be better?
Ignoring any arguments about better colors or contrast between the two phones, which have nothing to do with resolution, and that in my case the Nexus 4 looks little different from the Nexus 5 in color and contrast anyway, what about differences the extra resolution and slightly larger diagonal make?
Personally, I fail to see any differences in day to day use, even looking close up everything looks equal on both displays. Yes if I look very closely, closer than I would ever use the device in day to day use, I can just make out the pixel structure on the Nexus 4 where on the Nexus 5 I can't.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can kid yourself but I regularly see substantial difference between the N5's 1080p and my GNex's 720p display and the GNex display is about the same as the Nexus 4. If you don't mind missing video information/detail then it makes sense to save some money on a middle of the road phone or buy a slightly overpriced moto x.
On the contrary, most are pleased with fine details in images and videos. If we weren't, the entire HD imaging industry wouldn't be where it is today. It's not marketing, it's consumer demand.

1080p is nice but I would have actually prefered a 720p display if it had the great view angles and contrast of the 2nd generation nexus 7. The panel on that is much nicer despite only being 323ppi.

Hi
TiltedAz said:
You can kid yourself but I regularly see substantial difference between the N5's 1080p and my GNex's 720p display and the GNex display is about the same as the Nexus 4. If you don't mind missing video information/detail then it makes sense to save some money on a middle of the road phone or buy a slightly overpriced moto x.
On the contrary, most are pleased with fine details in images and videos. If we weren't, the entire HD imaging industry wouldn't be where it is today. It's not marketing, it's consumer demand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not kidding myself I have both phones, I'm not trying to justify not buying a Nexus 5, I already did
The entire HD industry was built upon HD Ready TVs, at only 720P in the main to start with, set to retina burning brightness and dynamic contrast out the box so they could be sold with contrast ratios of 1,000,000:1 (remember big numbers sell more). The vast majority of people never adjust the TV to true to life settings, and then wonder why anyone with a tan looks orange, even if the tan isn't fake and just accept it! Here in the UK at least, HD broadcasts are so compressed they barely resolve more detail than a standard definition picture should. Our standard definition channels are so compressed they break up regularly into a mosaic of blocks and barely resolve the detail of 360P YouTube clip circa 1995. The vast majority of people don't question the quality, and many thought they were already watching HD just because the TV had an HD sticker on it, and I know a lot of these people. People on the whole don't really care about quality. Marketing swept people towards HD TV, and there are a huge number of people with HD TVs watching nothing more than badly over-compressed standard definition TV and streamed video, none the wiser.
Can a really over compressed 720P video streamed YouTube clip (I don't think they stream 1080P to mobile devices currently) on a 5" display be sharper with more detail when that display is 1080P and not 720P?
If you don't mind missing video information/detail then it makes sense to save some money on a middle of the road phone or buy a slightly overpriced moto x.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you do mind missing video information than wouldn't want to watch YouTube or any other for mobile compressed video at all, most of the detail is thrown away in compression. Instead you'd sit down with your friends and family, hire or buy the Blu-ray version of a movie, have a good quality HD TV probably adjusted with a DTS AV decoder and surround sound audio, and enjoy the film as it was intended by the director.
For YouTube clips of someone pouring water over their new Nexus 5 or dropping it on to concrete until it smashes, clips of moody cats, or unboxing reviews of the latest gagdet, I think any resolution of 5" display will do just fine for the vast majority of people.
My argument really isn't relating to us techy types who pixel peek, but the vast majority of people that are persuaded to buy a new mobile phone on the basis of larger numbers driven by marketing, when in reality the benefits are not that great.
Regards
Phil

The Nexus 4 is actually 1280x768, not 1280x720. Anyway, I agree that it has become a marketing game, with 2560x1440 and higher phone displays already planned. It's questionable even if it doesn't cost a penny, because those extra pixels slow down the screen rendering.

Nexus 5 screen size, real estate, and battery

The Nexus 5 looks and runs great, but everything's so big I feel like I'm using a toy phone. The PPI really would have made more sense on a 4.5/4.7" screen (or even a 4" screen for us small-handed), and for a budget phone I would have expected 720p (pixels) resolution. This would use less battery which would require less battery so it could have kept about the same thinness (but I'm perfectly happy adding thickness and heft for more battery).
I don't understand Google's thinking behind this phone. It's a great-quality phone, but it's just too big for the things on the screen. They look great about 10 inches away but normal distance from my face, about 7", everything just looks oversized. I feel like at this screen size they could have added another column or row to the launcher and had them match up to the bottom dock shortcuts.
I know how to change the PPI, but I would just more like to know what made Google decide to go with such huge icons and fonts on such a large screen with full HD (1080p) resolution and not add any more real estate to things like Chrome or Settings or anything.

dhinged said:
The Nexus 5 looks and runs great, but everything's so big I feel like I'm using a toy phone. The PPI really would have made more sense on a 4.5/4.7" screen (or even a 4" screen for us small-handed), and for a budget phone I would have expected 720p (pixels) resolution. This would use less battery which would require less battery so it could have kept about the same thinness (but I'm perfectly happy adding thickness and heft for more battery).
I don't understand Google's thinking behind this phone. It's a great-quality phone, but it's just too big for the things on the screen. They look great about 10 inches away but normal distance from my face, about 7", everything just looks oversized. I feel like at this screen size they could have added another column or row to the launcher and had them match up to the bottom dock shortcuts.
I know how to change the PPI, but I would just more like to know what made Google decide to go with such huge icons and fonts on such a large screen with full HD (1080p) resolution and not add any more real estate to things like Chrome or Settings or anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't change the PPI, you change the density lol
The Nexus 5 isn't really meant to be as much of a "budget phone" as it is a "developer device" (officially for AOSP, and unofficially on here) or "reference device for other OEMs", hence why it has a 1080p display and a Qualcomm Snapdragon 800. It just happens to be cheaper as they also cut some corners (and probably to make it burn a smaller hole in developer's wallets).
Anyways, nothing looks "oversized" without changing the density. Most (if not, then all) Android devices have the density set relative to the resolution (NOT physical screen size nor pixels per inch) as well as what sort of device it is (phone or tablet). It's a standard, not "whatever the OEM wants", if an OEM wants something to appear smaller or larger in their bloated system apps, they're going to modify the app itself, not change the density (which affects ALL apps rather than just the intended). I also have a Note 3 (which I never use and just gathers dust), it's the same resolution but much larger, and the stock density on that is also set to 480 (same as the Nexus 5). I also know that the HTC One (M8) and OnePlus One are also set to 480. Just about ANY Android phone with a 1080p display uses 480 (stock, at least), I don't know of one that doesn't.

dhinged said:
The Nexus 5 looks and runs great, but everything's so big I feel like I'm using a toy phone. The PPI really would have made more sense on a 4.5/4.7" screen (or even a 4" screen for us small-handed), and for a budget phone I would have expected 720p (pixels) resolution. This would use less battery which would require less battery so it could have kept about the same thinness (but I'm perfectly happy adding thickness and heft for more battery).
I don't understand Google's thinking behind this phone. It's a great-quality phone, but it's just too big for the things on the screen. They look great about 10 inches away but normal distance from my face, about 7", everything just looks oversized. I feel like at this screen size they could have added another column or row to the launcher and had them match up to the bottom dock shortcuts.
I know how to change the PPI, but I would just more like to know what made Google decide to go with such huge icons and fonts on such a large screen with full HD (1080p) resolution and not add any more real estate to things like Chrome or Settings or anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nova Launcher is the solution

I liked more the Galaxy Nexus size. Based on my experience "width" is what matters for one-handed phones.
However....5" is not bad. The only f***** thing here is the resolution. 1080p is a waste for a simple 5" screen.
It must be something slightly bigger than 720 without jumping to 1080.
Sent from my Nexus 5

I have no problem with the dpi [emoji4]

thesebastian said:
I liked more the Galaxy Nexus size. Based on my experience "width" is what matters for one-handed phones.
However....5" is not bad. The only f***** thing here is the resolution. 1080p is a waste for a simple 5" screen.
It must be something slightly bigger than 720 without jumping to 1080.
Sent from my Nexus 5
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1080 isn't a waste at all. Its HD. If it makes sense on a 32" TV several feet away, it makes sense on a 5".screen several inches away. Its called "viewing distance".
Choosing some arbitrary resolution between 720 and 1080 is a silly idea. These resolutions are a global standard and media content is created to these standards. Choosing something win between would mean no content was optimised for our display so something would be lost in the downscaling or upscaling.
1080p is perfect for the distance you view it. If you sit 1 metre away from a 50" 1080p TV, it won't look HD. It will look lower blocky. That is because the pixels are literally bigger than a 32" TV of the same resolution. Its designed to be viewed from further away. As you move the TV further away, the image gets clearer as the pixels appear smaller.
All PPI is about is measuring the amount of pixels in an inch. This is a fixed value. A 1080 screen always has the same amount of pixels. This means the pixels are bigger on a bigger screen, so the PPI decreases. The smaller the PPI is, the further away you would expect to view it from.
1080p on a 5" screen would be ridiculous if the device was intended to be used at over 1 metre away though. Because that is beyond the optimum viewing distance. It would mean that the image again lost detail.
I think 2k and 4k on this size screen is over kill. But that's not because of these reasons. We would definitely notice a sharper image on the display. The problem is that there is a massive performance hit. The GPU works harder meaning its slower than it would be on a lower resolution. It uses battery because of this.since there is very little content, its not a worthwhile trade off at this time.
That said though, visually it would look better. The screen may need to be 6" to really get the benefit though. Otherwise the PPI would be too high for the viewing distance and your need to move the display closer than the screen closer than the usual distance to get the full effect
DPI is something entirely different. That's what causes the assets on screen (buttons, icons etc) to appear bigger or smaller.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Yeah I know all that. Just saying...1080 is a waste for a 5". A waste of GPU and resources.
We don't really need more than 330ppi on a Phone....
Sent from my Nexus 5

thesebastian said:
Yeah I know all that. Just saying...1080 is a waste for a 5". A waste of GPU and resources.
We don't really need more than 330ppi on a Phone....
Sent from my Nexus 5
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your first sentence directly contradicts your last sentence. If you understood optimal viewing distances you would know that we do need a higher PPI. Why should we be restricted to lower quality videos on a mobile phone?
Yes,it uses more resources to play higher resolution content. But its not a waste because a majority of content is at that resolution
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Well at the distance I use the phone 330ppi is optimal!
I think 330 is ok for phones. Look at the iPhones they've a good screen without having 400+ PPI.
Sent from my Nexus 5

thesebastian said:
Well at the distance I use the phone 330ppi is optimal!
I think 330 is ok for phones. Look at the iPhones they've a good screen without having 400+ PPI.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can see you're still a bit confused about your argument. PPI is not the unit of measure you should be using. It does nothing to tell us resolution OR screensize so as a number on it's own is entirely useless.
PPI is just a result of resolution and screen size
PPI = width squared + length squared, divided by the square root of screen size.
Optimal viewing distance is about resolution and screen size. The bigger a screen, the further away it needs to be for the resolution to be correct. You can't say "330ppi is optimal" because that's not how it works. You can have 2 completely different resolutions with the same PPI.
For example, on a 5" screen, 720x1500 would be 330 PPI.
Similarly, on a 10" screen, 1500x2950 would be 330 PPI.
The optimal viewing distance of both these example screens is completely different so to say that 330PPI is optimal for a distance is wholly wrong. You cannot use PPI as a valid unit of measure unless you first specify a screen size. There is no such thing as optimal viewing distance for a PPI.
Optimal viewing distance is about resolution and screen size. If you stick to 1 resolution (lets use 1080p as the obvious example), the optimal viewing distance of a 5" screen is less than the optimal viewing distance of a 10" screen. This is because the pixels are bigger on the 10" screen. if you compare an image on a 10" screen to an image of a 5" screen at the same resolution AND distance, and at the opwholeytimal viewing distance of the 5" screen, the 4" image will be crisp and share where as the 10" image will be blocky. You have to increase the viewing distance of the 10" screen to get the same crisp image.
wholey
You can practice this yourself. Put a 1080p movie on your Phone and TV. Watch the movie on your phone at 5" from your face. Watch teh movie on the TV at the same distance. Forget the fact you cannot see the entire screen. Focus on the centre of the screen. You will be able to pick out individual pixels and the section of the screen you are looking at will not appear as a single image. Just a series of blocks. The bigger your TV, the more noticeable this will be.
To get a 330 PPI value on a 4.95" screen like the nexus 5, and maintain 16:9 aspect ratio, you'd be looking at 1450x816 resolution. There are ways to work out optimal viewing distances, but it's quite complex. If you're interested, you can find that information here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimum_HDTV_viewing_distance
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VD: Viewing distance
DS: Display's diagonal size
NHR: Display's native horizontal resolution (in pixels)
NVR: Display's native vertical resolution (in pixels)
CVR: Vertical resolution of the video being displayed (in pixels)
The optimal viewing distance for a screen the size of a nexus 5 is 7.2 inches (0.6 foot) - which is about what we hold it at.*
*based on:
http://www.calculatorpro.com/calculator/tv-screen-size-calculator/
http://myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html
Now I suppose when we get up to 2k and 4k, there will be a problem. At that distance, the human eye may fail to recognise a difference between 1080p and higher resolutions. To get benefit, the screen would need to be bigger and further away...although some say for those holding the screen right up close to their face, characters will look better
All that said, I can recognise a difference between 720p and 1080p at that distance. So yeah, 1080p is about for a screen our size. Or also for a tablet, which typically would use ant a slightly further way distance than a phone.
So really, it all depends on your eyesight or how short your arms are. If you hold the phone too close to your face, 1080p is not optimal on a 5" screen. You would probably want a smaller screen or a higher resolution, otherwise it may appear blocky. At the appropriate distance for a mobile phone, anything over 1080p may be pointless but bringing it closer may prove beneficial, but that could cause eye strain as you're focusing too close.
There is a really useful chart here
In summary:
If you hold your phone further than the optimal distance, you may get away with losing some resolution as the further away it is, the less you'll notice. OR you need a bigger screen to make it the optimal viewing distance for that resolution
If you hold your phone closer than the optimal distance, you could need to get a higher resolution OR a smaller screen
Like TV's, you should buy the size or resolution based on your fixed viewing distance. For a TV, its the resolution standard of 1080p (because most of our content is that resolution) then you look at the distance your sofa is from the TV stand and buy the correct size. Assuming you need the same resolution for content on your phone, you look at the distance and buy the appropriate screen size. People who hold their phones closer will want a smaller screen for 1080. People who hold them further away will want a bigger screen at that resolution. This trend will continue as content resolution increases, but this cannot go on forever.

Yeah sorry, when i said "phone" i was meant aproximately 5"... Not 4" or 6" or much more.
I was trying to say that I prefer a 5" screen with 720p than a 5" screen with 1080p. Regardless of the lose of quality.

thesebastian said:
Yeah sorry, when i said "phone" i was meant aproximately 5"... Not 4" or 6" or much more.
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Ok no worries.
As I say, it depends on how good your eyes are and how far away you hold your phone. 1080 is about right for a 5" screen if you have 20/20 vision and hold your phone an average distance from your face, so the 1080p resolution is the average for our phone.
thesebastian said:
I was trying to say that I prefer a 5" screen with 720p than a 5" screen with 1080p. Regardless of the lose of quality.
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So then this probably means that you hold your phone a little further away than average... and if you do that's fine. It just means that you're outside the bounds of what a Nexus 5 is catered for, which is the masses (average)
EDIT > I'm like you though, but with 1080. 1080 is great for me with a 5" screen. A higher resolution at that size would be almost pointless for me as I would need to hold it closer, so to get a 2k phone, I would need a bigger screen size as holding it closer isn't really an option.

rootSU said:
EDIT > I'm like you though, but with 1080. 1080 is great for me with a 5" screen. A higher resolution at that size would be almost pointless for me as I would need to hold it closer, so to get a 2k phone, I would need a bigger screen size as holding it closer isn't really an option.
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Just thought I'd say I agree with you lol 1080p is enough on a phone, for most. On a tablet however, higher than 1080p would be pretty nice if the specifications support it decently.

Lethargy said:
Just thought I'd say I agree with you lol 1080p is enough on a phone, for most. On a tablet however, higher than 1080p would be pretty nice if the specifications support it decently.
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Yeah. I also forgot to say that bigger than a 5" screen is also not an option for me as I cant reach everywhere one handed. So I cannot increase screen size and I cannot ergonomically reduce viewing distance, so I am stuck at 1080. With a tablet, one-handed operation wouldn't be a restriction, so I could increase screen size. My viewing distance would be largely the same, so the 1080p resolution could get blocky with a bigger screen if I don't increase the resolution.
Not sure what the next gen of phones I buy will offer. I'm possibly willing to go up to 5.5". BUT I don't think that increase in size would warrant an increase in resolution for me. So if OEM's start to make 2k the standard, I'm going to have a problem.

rootSU said:
Yeah. I also forgot to say that bigger than a 5" screen is also not an option for me as I cant reach everywhere one handed. So I cannot increase screen size and I cannot ergonomically reduce viewing distance, so I am stuck at 1080. With a tablet, one-handed operation wouldn't be a restriction, so I could increase screen size. My viewing distance would be largely the same, so the 1080p resolution could get blocky with a bigger screen if I don't increase the resolution.
Not sure what the next gen of phones I buy will offer. I'm possibly willing to go up to 5.5". BUT I don't think that increase in size would warrant an increase in resolution for me. So if OEM's start to make 2k the standard, I'm going to have a problem.
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The Nexus 5's 4.95" and 1080p already feels perfect.. I have a Note 3 and never use it since I hate the size (and not to mention being a Samsung product). I have a feeling that if newer devices are going to be larger, I'll be sticking with my Nexus 5 for a little longer.

Lethargy said:
The Nexus 5's 4.95" and 1080p already feels perfect.. I have a Note 3 and never use it since I hate the size (and not to mention being a Samsung product). I have a feeling that if newer devices are going to be larger, I'll be sticking with my Nexus 5 for a little longer.
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True that.. Note 2/3 have attractive amoled screens, but when it comes to an actual professional pure crisp and sharp screen nexus 5 is damm good.. Extremely sharp and natural colors

Lethargy said:
The Nexus 5's 4.95" and 1080p already feels perfect.. I have a Note 3 and never use it since I hate the size (and not to mention being a Samsung product). I have a feeling that if newer devices are going to be larger, I'll be sticking with my Nexus 5 for a little longer.
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I think for a lot of people, 5" is the sweet spot.

ali262883 said:
True that.. Note 2/3 have attractive amoled screens, but when it comes to an actual professional pure crisp and sharp screen nexus 5 is damm good.. Extremely sharp and natural colors
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AMOLED.. Personally I think they're ugh. Mostly people who do nothing but Facebook/etc on their silly Samsung devices (aka the majority) say its better, but colour reproduction means nothing to them. Lol. I love the Nexus 5's screen.

Lethargy said:
AMOLED.. Personally I think they're ugh. Mostly people who do nothing but Facebook/etc on their silly Samsung devices (aka the majority) say its better, but colour reproduction means nothing to them. Lol. I love the Nexus 5's screen.
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Its a compromise. LCD is better colour reproduction but then Amoled have individual pixel lighting, meaning pure black saves energy and also can be used as a night clock without the entire backlight panel lighting up the room.
2 ways to address this.
1) Colour profiles for AMOLED.
2) LED backlighting like TV's for LCD

I love my lcd screen more than my friend's s4 amoled screen [emoji14].. Its colorful but not as sharp as that of nexus 5.. And whites are completely dead..

Gear VR "Review"

I ordered mine with free shipping Thursday afternoon and got it yesterday.
+Good build
+Comes with a hard case (device is already in it, along with sd card)
+Fairly straight forward process
Before putting the device on head:
1. Dragged the Gear sd card folders to my 128gb card
2. Installed the VRintro APK to get the software install process started (the main apps are installed)
3. The process requires a simple registration to access the Oculus market
4. I skipped the card process since already dragged the content to my 128.
5. Once registered, the Oculus Cinema installs
6. Then the fun starts! Put the N4 in the Gear and adjust the gear to fit head
7. Then a brief simple calibration process and tutorial
Quick perspective / review:
1. More immersive than expected
2. Games are good for demos, but I mainly got it for movies
3. The 3D & 360 are surprisingly good
4. The Oculus Cinema ROCKS!!!
5. 2D movies worked fine. The only thing I could not get to work was an older concert from Youtube that was in FLV format and one avi. AVI, MP4, WMV and MKV worked fine.
6. The best Cinema options IMO are Cinema and Void. Void is nice since you can lay down and re- orientate the device view Void also provides the most display real-estate , so highest resolution. That said, I prefer Cinema a tad more due to the immersion.
7. Speaking of resolution, it is best described as between around 720p or a tad less. Before you balk at that, the experience more than compensates and the sense of large scale is impressive and the image quality is very good. Screen door goes away in your mind after a minute or two.
8. Device got real warm, but Void mode was less so, since just a black background.
9. Battery life for me was a tad over four hours watching video. Void mode might add 30 minutes.
10. Did not test a controller yet, but forum reports are any bluetooth controller should work.
11. Also did not test many images, but the immersion was great there too.
I can see this becoming HUGE for Note 4 owners and others companies jumping on the bandwagon. Also eating my words on Qhd being overkill. I now want HIGHER res on the Note 5 so video looks even better
If you are a Note 4 owner and video fan: Buy This Now

mine comes in Thursday. can't wait!

Mine is in 9n Friday and I am PUMPED. Only thing that concerns me is future support. I would really like samsung and Oculus to continue support and place a lot of effort in nourishing a healthy developer environment.

rushless said:
6. The best Cinema options IMO are Cinema and Void. Void is nice since you can lay down and re- orientate the device view Void also provides the most display real-estate , so highest resolution. That said, I prefer Cinema a tad more due to the immersion.
7. Speaking of resolution, it is best described as between around 720p or a tad less. Before you balk at that, the experience more than compensates and the sense of large scale is impressive and the image quality is very good. Screen door goes away in your mind after a minute or two.
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I too want this mostly for movie watching. I'm wondering how crazy I'd look on a plane with this. :laugh:
Can you describe a bit more about the movie experience? Is it like watching a 60" tv from a few feet away, a movie theater screen from far away, etc?

Awesome review! +1
PS - 3 New games came out on the Gear VR Store. Check it out.

my experience was 4 out of 10....I bought it to watch movies on it...but seriously you can actually count all the pixals, the quality of the video is that bad, I have the HD Quality videos loaded....now I also feel a headache after wear it for almost 30 min...mind it I don't wear glasses....It's a great start but a long way before it could be something of use.....so I'll wait for version 10 or something.
It came with a box, SD CARD Adapter and Mircro-SD card 16GB, also It came with a cleaning cloth to clean the leans...
the phone got headed after using it for 30 min, as if someone had just taken it out from micro oven--hope it doesn't burn my phone..

loaferkan said:
my experience was 4 out of 10....I bought it to watch movies on it...but seriously you can actually count all the pixals, the quality of the video is that bad, I have the HD Quality videos loaded....now I also feel a headache after wear it for almost 30 min...mind it I don't wear glasses....It's a great start but a long way before it could be something of use.....so I'll wait for version 10 or something.
It came with a box, SD CARD Adapter and Mircro-SD card 16GB, also It came with a cleaning cloth to clean the leans...
the phone got headed after using it for 30 min, as if someone had just taken it out from micro oven--hope it doesn't burn my phone..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wonder if 2k video improves pixel issue... have you tried watching 4k in cinema mode?

Even with the Note 4 high resolution its still not enough not to notice pixels. I heard that you need like a 16k display which sounds impossible. And it is normal for the phone to get hot and that's per the operator's manual.
But not everyone can physically handle this type of experience. That's the reason why Samsung did not allow this product to be sold in stores like bestbuy. This product is not targeted to the casual user. The majority of experiences will be us geeks showing it off to other people which will drum up interest. And it also gives Samsung and Oculus time to fine tune it for Note 5. Gear VR is a step above the development kits but slightly below a consumer ready product.

Bruce lee roy said:
Wonder if 2k video improves pixel issue... have you tried watching 4k in cinema mode?
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yes the 2k videos look great, and even the 3D does a better job......

EvanWasHere said:
I too want this mostly for movie watching. I'm wondering how crazy I'd look on a plane with this. :laugh:
Can you describe a bit more about the movie experience? Is it like watching a 60" tv from a few feet away, a movie theater screen from far away, etc?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is like watching a 100" projector and the cinema is just like being in a huge cinema.

loaferkan said:
my experience was 4 out of 10....I bought it to watch movies on it...but seriously you can actually count all the pixals, the quality of the video is that bad, I have the HD Quality videos loaded....now I also feel a headache after wear it for almost 30 min...mind it I don't wear glasses....It's a great start but a long way before it could be something of use.....so I'll wait for version 10 or something.
It came with a box, SD CARD Adapter and Mircro-SD card 16GB, also It came with a cleaning cloth to clean the leans...
the phone got headed after using it for 30 min, as if someone had just taken it out from micro oven--hope it doesn't burn my phone..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you look for the pixels and focus on them, it could detract, but the point is the total experience and the screen door fades from focus. Kind of like anything else if you focus on it Case in point, I notice and could count pixels in movies theaters and plasma sets. Especially the bigger digital screen systems. Everything is relative
The best view is Void if you want to minimize the pixel issue (also reduces device heat and extends battery). The home theater mode makes the pixels stand out and is like 480p due to less space for the video.
Just imagine a 1080p device with a Gear VR. That would be like an old school bar projector . Samsung knew what they were doing using Qhd. Next years S6 and Note 5 apparently up the resolution and likely the VR products are part of their reasoning for the higher res.
My N4 did not get hot as you describe, but I could see intense 3D games doing that, but I will not be playing them. Did not get the headache issues either, but depends on the person of course.

I got mine yesterday and played around with it a bit last night. My opinion is it is really cool and shows where VR could eventually go but definitely don't expect everything to be perfect yet. It all comes down to your attitude going into the experience.
1) Yes the pixels are noticeable and it is a bit worse than watching a hockey game sitting behind the netting behind the goal. You absolutely see and notice the "screen door" but you also can choose to overlook it based on the very cool experience. You also can imagine that in 2-4 years that issue will go away.
2) I wouldn't call things blurry as is being discussed in another thread yet rather the whole viewing image is not in focus. If I look straight at text it is reasonably clear but anything above, below, left or right of where my eyes are focusing will be slightly out of focus. If I move my eyes (and head) just slightly to look at a different area that becomes more in focus as compared to what I had been looking at. For the large images you don't really notice the whole effect so much but when there is a lot of different text on the screen in different areas you will certainly notice it.
3) When you first put the headset on you notice that you are looking through lenses and somewhat notice the blackness associated where your eyes are getting covered up. After a short while you stop really thinking about this and get taken into the experience.
You might read all of this as me not thinking highly of the VR or that this is just another gimmick. Let me come full out and say that isn't how I feel and I was pretty much blown away by the whole thing. I can't wait to see where VR goes from here. The first time you are watching the demo and then hear something to the right and turn your head and see something on your right that you had no idea was there you will get sucked in. From there you keep looking to your left, right and behind you and become pretty amazed.
So my take is that there are certainly issues and VR is not "there" yet but from this experience you really start to understand where VR could go and it no longer feels like an impossible technological hurdle to climb. It is no longer a question of if VR is really possible but more a question of when we are going to get there.

They need more pixels in order to increase the FOV and reduce the screen door. The Note 5 should be even better. Just hoping they keep the form factor of the Note 5 the same as the Note 5 to fit the Gear VR. That said, I will get $200 worth of fun out of this in a year, regardless.
None the less, the Gear VR is a worthy purchase for video fans IMO.

rushless said:
It is like watching a 100" projector and the cinema is just like being in a huge cinema.
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If true, this is freaking amazing.

Bruce lee roy said:
If true, this is freaking amazing.
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The catch is the resolution is less in that mode. Does look cool though.

I have played with my Gear VR for a few days and I totally agree with the review. The experience is amazing. This tech is gonna go really far. It has an insane potential.

Killemalll said:
I have played with my Gear VR for a few days and I totally agree with the review. The experience is amazing. This tech is gonna go really far. It has an insane potential.
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Yeah, im in the same boat, this thing literally blew me away. Showed a lot of folks at work this thing and they were amazed as well. It's definitely the new form of entertainment. The key word is immersive. I think with the sensons onboard the gear vr, it really helps with that. I know the Note 4 has a better screen than the oculus version but I feel we'll need at least 8k or 10k displays to eliminate the screen door effect. But overall, daaaaaammmn.

well i just received mine and all i can say is that i am blown away by it. what am amazing experience. finally, VR for the masses is set to be a reality. i let the wife and kids try it and they were all giggly over it too. one complaint: wearing eyeglasses with it sucks

rushless said:
It is like watching a 100" projector and the cinema is just like being in a huge cinema.
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I have a 100" projector screen in my bedroom and it's no where close to the experience you get when you watch the cinema selection. The screen is bigger than many movie theaters I go to. And the wide video is just crazy. No home theater can touch that.

HTCMario said:
well i just received mine and all i can say is that i am blown away by it. what am amazing experience. finally, VR for the masses is set to be a reality. i let the wife and kids try it and they were all giggly over it too. one complaint: wearing eyeglasses with it sucks
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Wearing glasses with Gear VR is pretty uncormfortable i assume, can the focus wheel not adjust to your eyesight without glasses properly?

Best VR Glasses for Cell phone to watch movie?

I'm looking for the best VR Glasses for Cell phone to watch movie. Obviously Gear VR isn't the best due to reason explained here.

Gear VR may not be the best but there is nothing better in this price range. Possibly there are some military grade glasses with direct retinal projection but they ate not available to general population. Gear VR for S6 supposedly is little better due to smaller pixels.
Sent from my SM-N910T using XDA Free mobile app

Gear VR would be better IMO if the lens view was a little further back. It currently is like sitting in the front two rows of the theater. It would be nicer IMO if eight to ten rows instead. Less screen door then as well.
You can move back rows in the app, but that is digital (not lens based) so means less content per pixel, so even MORE screen door effect. I do not see the value in it, but some think it is nice. I just notice more
screen door that is already border-line too much for movies as it is without software shifting back rows. This will not get better until a 4K display is avialable, or the next Gear allows lens adjustment for the bigger displays.
Apparently the Note 5 will not be 4K since the tech will not be cost effective yet to cover the lead-time of mass production for the Note 5. That is rumor to this point though.

[Q] How is the resolution for gear vr?

Hey folks. I have a question before I purchase the gear vr for s6. How is the screen resolution? I heard it is like youre watching a 360p or 480p video. I heard it is better than the note 4 vr. So kindly shed some light of note 4 vr resolution display and/or s6 vr. Thanks.

With the Note 4 Gear VR, you're gonna see all the subpixels, that's for sure. As ludicrous as 515 PPI sounds for normal phone use (and it is), the Gear VR's lenses ruthlessly reveal the PenTile diamond structure used once you've got the focus dialed in. I doubt the S6 is going to be any different in practice, only that there's less magnification and a lower FOV.
Saying it's like a 360p or 480p video isn't really giving it enough credit, though. It's more like 720p, which makes sense because the eye buffers generally run at about 1000x1000 for performance reasons. (You could possibly squeeze out a bit more like 1280x1280 if the scene isn't too intensive.)
But here's the thing: while the resolution may seem inadequate, you tend to forget about it really quickly. Low-latency head-tracking, smooth framerates and wide FOV are far more critical to the VR experience than resolution, honestly, because it's those things that really establish a sense of presence.

I don't know about the exact resolution, but is not that good. Although for a first product it is amazing. It really makes you feel you are there. The DPI are not really an indication of any sort.

I sent mine back as i was not happy with the screen door effect. To be honest if you are considering splashing out £170.00 then i would hold out until the newer VR models come out next year for PC's as the content is very limited at the moment.