I used SuperSu many, many years ago and figured I would give it a try an old e5 Plus that's been collecting dust in a junk drawer. Using Platform Tools, TWRP and a SuperSu zip the whole process took maybe 10 minutes.
I noticed that all of the guides here use Magisk and they look fairly complicated for the average user. Is there a reason why it's favored over SuperSu? Now that I'm rooted, can I use Magisk and all of its features (modules, etc)?
SuperSU is more easily detected by banking apps, Netflix, Disney+, Google Pay etc. As it modifies the system partition while Magisk is a system-less root.
dbohnine said:
Now that I'm rooted, can I use Magisk and all of its features (modules, etc)?
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I think you can install Magisk using the SuperSU root. But anyway if you want to use Magisk features, you will need to install Magisk.
Related
I'm new to Magisk, and one thing I'm confused about is the role of the various systemless modules.
1. Essentially, is there anything that I *can't* do normally with Magisk (that I would be able to do if it were rooted any other way) that I *have to* have a module for?
For example, when you have modules to have systemless hosts or systemless Busybox - does that mean that when you use Magisk, you *can't* install or work with these things without those modules, or does it mean that you still could do it normally, but the modules just give you an option to do it without actually modifying anything?
2. If the answer is that I can still do everything normally, but the modules just give me the *option* to do it without actually modifying /system, then why does it matter?
For example, I've never minded having an adblock application actually modify the hosts file when I've rooted in the past before Magisk, so what advantage is there to redirecting them to a fake hosts file? If anything, I would think it increases the chance that something will go wrong or that there will be an incompatibility somewhere along the way.
Everything that Magisk does systemlessly can be done in the old and normal way of modifying system files.
The main advantage for me to use Magisk modules is that all the modifications are still there after a system update (since they'll be in the Magisk image which is kept in /data/adb). I won't have to redo them like I used to before Magisk...
For those that care about updating their device through an OTA, systemless modifications will also make sure that will still work, sort of. You'll still have to keep a stock recovery and restore your stock boot image before updating, but with newer devices that's getting a lot easier. More details here: https://topjohnwu.github.io/Magisk/tutorials.html#ota-installation
Didgeridoohan said:
Everything that Magisk does systemlessly can be done in the old and normal way of modifying system files.
The main advantage for me to use Magisk modules is that all the modifications are still there after a system update (since they'll be in the Magisk image which is kept in /data/adb). I won't have to redo them like I used to before Magisk...
For those that care about updating their device through an OTA, systemless modifications will also make sure that will still work, sort of. You'll still have to keep a stock recovery and restore your stock boot image before updating, but with newer devices that's getting a lot easier. More details here: https://topjohnwu.github.io/Magisk/tutorials.html#ota-installation
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Gotcha! It's not obvious for people new to Magisk whether using a systemless root forces you to do everything in a systemless manner afterwards or not, so I really appreciate your clarifying this.
Haphim said:
Gotcha! It's not obvious for people new to Magisk whether using a systemless root forces you to do everything in a systemless manner afterwards or not, so I really appreciate your clarifying this.
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No worries. Just want to point out that systemless root isn't Magisk specific. SuperSU and phh's superuser are two examples of root solutions that were systemless long before MagiskSU was a thing...
Hi,
First, I'm a noob with some experience!
I know how to root my phone with Magisk and I helped Jen to root the LG G4 Vigor (H731) for Videotron/Telus. She was working on the H735 if I'm not mistaken but it worked for mine too since it's the same phone without the same name. It was with SuperSu, I don't think Magisk was out at this time.
Well... at that time I bought Busybox Pro... I don't know why except everyone had it!!
I'd really like some explanation. I searched for at least 4 days, 1-4 hours per day and it was a LOTS of different things! I'm really confused about the difference between Busybox and Magisk, expect Magisk is SystemLess.
I can install "add-ons" with Magisk like Xposed!!
I really don't know what I can do with Busybox except installing "things" but are those "things" are like a module in Magisk/Xposed?
P.S. I know that if I install Xposed in Magisk, it become systemless like Magisk!
And! I know that I can install Busybox from Magisk! But I bought the Busybox Pro app from Google Play Store.
Can someone tell me all those differences? I'm really messed up and really need help +++ I think a good explanation could help lots of others than me.
Thank you VERY much!!!
Busybox is just a set of tools that some apps/programs/processes/etc use. Magisk actually has its own internal Busybox that it uses for a lot of things, but it's not exposed to the rest of your system, which is why you need to install a separate Busybox if something about your setup needs it. It used to be more common that a separate Busybox installation was needed, but nowadays not so much, since most apps that need it already come with their own version of it to ensure compatibility. You can read more about what Busybox is at https://www.busybox.net.
I actually had the same question. I've rooted a few of my devices already. And years back I've also bought some apps via Play-Store. But a lot of these apps seems to be dated and not maintained annymore.
For instance I've bought a few apps from JRummy back then, from which I still use Busybox and Rootchecker nowadays. But this bussybox seemed to be quite dated when looking to the last update moment.
I'm using Magisk now and I was thinking going to use it's integrated Busybox too. Can it just work next to each other? Or do I need to unstall the JRummy Bussybox before?
Didgeridoohan said:
Busybox is just a set of tools that some apps/programs/processes/etc use. Magisk actually has its own internal Busybox that it uses for a lot of things, but it's not exposed to the rest of your system, which is why you need to install a separate Busybox if something about your setup needs it. It used to be more common that a separate Busybox installation was needed, but nowadays not so much, since most apps that need it already come with their own version of it to ensure compatibility. You can read more about what Busybox is at https://www.busybox.net.
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You can activate and use busybox by typing or copy and paste the busybox magisk location. Such as
/data/adb/magisk/busybox xz -d /storage/emulated/0/Download/root.img.xz
This is the busybox command to decompress xz archive.. as long as your root with busybox no need to install unless an application requires it.
I have been rooting my Androids since the original G1 and obviously have always used a traditional root method. I have been trying to do some research on what to do with my next device, traditional root or systemless. The obvious advantage of systemless is passing safety net and probably not have to worry about using root cloak, although root cloak still serves me well to this day. The disadvantages I have found is that because Magisk doesnt actually modify system files it just puts a modified file over the existing one on boot you cannot actually simply go into say root explorer, take any file on the system partition and modify it. Which to me seems like a major disadvantage to anyone who likes to modify files in the system partition. I mean something as simple as swapping out a font file is not longer just a copy paste and change permissions. Am i completely off base on this thinking? Please correct me if I am wrong. The only part that seems to be a huge disadvantage to true root is no one is actually developing SuperSU anymore now that ChainFire sold it from what I understand but there is still the old school superuser app that i believe was open source and could be developed on, as I understood the Superuser apps only denied or granted superuser authority did not actually root the device in the first place anyway.
First of all, SuperSU was systemless root long before Magisk...
I believe you're confusing MagiskSU with Magisk modules and Magic mounting. It's perfectly possible to alter /system while Magisk is installed, as long as you don't have a module that is magic mounting files over that particular part of /system. If that's the case, you'll just be trying to alter the Magisk mask instead of the actual files. If you're not using modules, or if you keep Core Only Mode enabled this won't be an issue.
But, even with magic mounting active you've got full access to the original /system files in /sbin/.magisk/mirror.
Didgeridoohan said:
First of all, SuperSU was systemless root long before Magisk...
I believe you're confusing MagiskSU with Magisk modules and Magic mounting. It's perfectly possible to alter /system while Magisk is installed, as long as you don't have a module that is magic mounting files over that particular part of /system. If that's the case, you'll just be trying to alter the Magisk mask instead of the actual files. If you're not using modules, or if you keep Core Only Mode enabled this won't be an issue.
But, even with magic mounting active you've got full access to the original /system files in /sbin/.magisk/mirror.
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ah yes i do recall hearing about systemless SuperSU but it seemed that it just installed SuperSU on the user partition and not as a system app and still allowed modifying the system partition. Sorry for my ignorance about this just tough to google how magisk actually works compared to normal root. So if I have magisk it is systemless root but I can still modify the system partition? Thats good to know. What about when it comes to Xposed, can you use normal Xposed with systemless root or do you have to use systemless xposed? Im currently running lolipop with full root and xposed framework but have a new device with Oreo that Ill probably give Magisk a shot with I just want to know the differences I should expect with what you can and cannot do.
Joe333x said:
ah yes i do recall hearing about systemless SuperSU but it seemed that it just installed SuperSU on the user partition and not as a system app and still allowed modifying the system partition. Sorry for my ignorance about this just tough to google how magisk actually works compared to normal root. So if I have magisk it is systemless root but I can still modify the system partition? Thats good to know. What about when it comes to Xposed, can you use normal Xposed with systemless root or do you have to use systemless xposed? Im currently running lolipop with full root and xposed framework but have a new device with Oreo that Ill probably give Magisk a shot with I just want to know the differences I should expect with what you can and cannot do.
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Yes you can use normal xposed on systemless root, systemless root basically roots by patching the kernel's ramdisk with the SU binary them magisk just install it's remaining binaries in the data partition and them proceeds to hide them through some Linux mounting tricks (it's just a simplified explanation) it's still normal root but the system partition gets intact,magisk and it's modules (in it's repository) use systemless installations as to hide from integrity checks like safetynet and allows you to more easily retain mods during rom updates,other than that magisk is just root with module and hiding functionality
---------- Post added at 12:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:46 AM ----------
Joe333x said:
ah yes i do recall hearing about systemless SuperSU but it seemed that it just installed SuperSU on the user partition and not as a system app and still allowed modifying the system partition. Sorry for my ignorance about this just tough to google how magisk actually works compared to normal root. So if I have magisk it is systemless root but I can still modify the system partition? Thats good to know. What about when it comes to Xposed, can you use normal Xposed with systemless root or do you have to use systemless xposed? Im currently running lolipop with full root and xposed framework but have a new device with Oreo that Ill probably give Magisk a shot with I just want to know the differences I should expect with what you can and cannot do.
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And if you are wondering how systemless mods (magisk modules) work they are basically 'mirrored' to the system partition during start up but the module itself is in the data partition
DanGLES3 said:
Yes you can use normal xposed on systemless root, systemless root basically roots by patching the kernel's ramdisk with the SU binary them magisk just install it's remaining binaries in the data partition and them proceeds to hide them through some Linux mounting tricks (it's just a simplified explanation) it's still normal root but the system partition gets intact,magisk and it's modules (in it's repository) use systemless installations as to hide from integrity checks like safetynet and allows you to more easily retain mods during rom updates,other than that magisk is just root with module and hiding functionality
---------- Post added at 12:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:46 AM ----------
And if you are wondering how systemless mods (magisk modules) work they are basically 'mirrored' to the system partition during start up but the module itself is in the data partition
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Thanks for the explanation I appreciate it, so now i guess my only question left is after I use magisk to root and then modify a file on the system partition will I now not pass safety net? I typically dont care about passing since I havent in years but just figured its a question worth asking.
Joe333x said:
Thanks for the explanation I appreciate it, so now i guess my only question left is after I use magisk to root and then modify a file on the system partition will I now not pass safety net? I typically dont care about passing since I havent in years but just figured its a question worth asking.
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If you are on an old device it's possible you still will pass,but sometimes altering an file on the conventional way will trip safetynet,that's why systemless modules are a thing
Just altering regular files shouldn't affect things though. It usually takes ROM level alterations...
I installed a new ROM on my tablet and couldn't get Magisk to work, so I restored the ROM I was using previously. But Magisk wasn't working in it anymore. In researching the problem, it seems that Google has not only removed Magisk Manager from the Play Store, but also found a way to keep previously installed Magisk from granting root privileges.
lewmur said:
I installed a new ROM on my tablet and couldn't get Magisk to work, so I restored the ROM I was using previously. But Magisk wasn't working in it anymore. In researching the problem, it seems that Google has not only removed Magisk Manager from the Play Store, but also found a way to keep previously installed Magisk from granting root privileges.
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You don't get Magisk from the playstore but from the Magisk thread.
Magisk
Magisk - The Universal Systemless Interface, to create an altered mask of the system without changing the system itself.
forum.xda-developers.com
Tulsadiver said:
You don't get Magisk from the playstore but from the Magisk thread.
Magisk
Magisk - The Universal Systemless Interface, to create an altered mask of the system without changing the system itself.
forum.xda-developers.com
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If you read my later post you'll see that I found that out and tried it. None of the versions work with the ROM based on Android 11. I have always just installed an the latest version Magisk.zip I happen to have handy and let it install Magisk Manager. Then I'd use Magisk Manager to update Magisk. That didn't work with the Android 11 ROM either. The update failed and the older version didn't root.
I'm cleaning up my ROG Phone 3 for playing PUBG Mobile. So i want to ask which debloat solution is best for performance and cleanliness? (BTW i saw that some methods may cause Basic Integrity (part of SafetyNet attest) to fail. And passing SafetyNet is must for me) My phone has unlocked bootloader, rooted with magisk and i can install TWRP if needed.
The ROG 3 stock rom can be fully debloated and cleaned up for blazing fast performance and battery life. Using a tool like App Manager (download from F-Droid) with root access is a good start in addition to the basic stuff like only allowing the few apps that you need to run in the background, etc. The app I just mentioned provides deep level of control for each app.
For SafetyNet: I pass and can hide root from each and every app (including some the toughest banking apps and games) with a Magisk 23 + SafetyNet Fix 2.1.1 + LSPosed & XPrivacy and with no performance hit. Should note that I run Android 10 and Magisk 23 and won't upgrade. I don't know how well it works on the latest firmware and Magisk versions (Magisk 24 no longer has Magisk Hide)
Re. debloating - are you just freezing bloatware or uninstalling it?
Any ADB based debloat solutions?
elmor0 said:
Re. debloating - are you just freezing bloatware or uninstalling it?
Any ADB based debloat solutions?
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How to uninstall carrier/OEM bloatware without root access
If you want to get rid of carrier/OEM apps from your phone, here's how you can uninstall bloatware from your device without root access!
www.xda-developers.com