Database Develop

HTCClassAction.org - October 9, 2008 - Kaiser / Polaris / Nike

The site is up and running, discussion here!

Frontpage is done, see http://www.htcclassaction.org/. Feel free to comment. None of the other pages on the site are done yet, though.

I understand the point of a petition, but a lawsuit? Why dont you get a Nokia or something,get your mind off things,cool down. I think youre coming across as a disgruntled former employee about to go postal.schitzo...

There isn't really a point to the petition, as companies don't really care. There probably isn't a big point with a class action lawsuit either, as it's entirely possible we won't win. It is something that should be investigated, as ultimately, it's just a way of applying pressure, getting publicity and raising awareness.
And nope, I'm not a former employee, but I am disgruntled by the way HTC is treating us.

Looks very good!

Vukile said:
I understand the point of a petition, but a lawsuit? Why dont you get a Nokia or something,get your mind off things,cool down. I think youre coming across as a disgruntled former employee about to go postal.schitzo...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What about people who already use their hard earned money and brought the device already?

jackleung said:
What about people who already use their hard earned money and brought the device already?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The most basic rule when buying a PDA: Only buy what you know youre getting, not what you think youre getting. I learnt that the hard way three years ago,its the same game all over. I think its an annual event.

Vukile said:
I understand the point of a petition, but a lawsuit? Why dont you get a Nokia or something,get your mind off things,cool down. I think youre coming across as a disgruntled former employee about to go postal.schitzo...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe you should read the main thread before posting crap like this. There are plenty of people, including myself who think a class action suite would be a good idea. Even if we didn't win or had no real grounds for one, the negative feedback alone could cause HTC to do something about the driver support.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=339745

Vukile said:
I understand the point of a petition, but a lawsuit? Why dont you get a Nokia or something,get your mind off things,cool down. I think youre coming across as a disgruntled former employee about to go postal.schitzo...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As Chainfire mentioned, petitions never work. This is because people eventually "cool off" and stop caring that they've been ripped off.
If I paid a lot less for my Kaiser, I wouldn't care as much that it's being outperformed by the older cheaper HTC models. We paid an arm and leg for these costly phones, we'd expect them to at least give us the basics (drivers).
How would you feel if you bought some fancy & expensive graphics board only to have to use the generic drivers that come with your OS?
Chainfire, great work. Let us know when you've set up the paypal account.

Oh, by the way, wonderful site Chainfire. It has all the info needed in one neatly organized site.

Excellent site Chainfire. If this is indicative of the effort you put into things, my previous (and future) donations have been well spent!! Very clear and to the point.
I posted a link on the "Proper video drivers...." sticky to a Google page tlaking about the bright new future of Android. Just wondered if it is worth highlighting to visitors to the site that HTC is one of the core companies developing this - perhaps if they realise HTC's attitude will affect more than just the current devices. Or maybe they won't care as most casual browsers don't know what Android is? Ah, I don't know.
Hey, if we draw public attention to all this, and then someone manages to address the issue here on XDA-devs, could that cause problems - infringment of copyright etc?

I don't understand the point of this petition, or a law suite for that matter. What do 99% of people do with their Kaisers anyway? There are lots of people around me where I work that use Windows smart phones and they are happy to get their push mail, GPS, bluetooth, whatever. I think they could care less about video drivers.
I'm not saying I wouldn't like to have some video acceleration, but most users probably could care less. We are the minority.
I think raising awareness is a great idea. Perhaps listing those manufactures that actually support their WinMo devices with proper drivers is even better, so potential buyers would know to spend their money else wehere.
I got my Kaiser as a Tilt from AT&T. I had 30 days to return it. I was given ample opportunity to play with it, install software, and make my complaint. I kept the device. No one was being forced to buy these things.
If you bought an unlocked Kaiser and spend a large bit of cash, well you take the first movers risk. No reason anyone couldn't wait to see what others though of the device before purchasing it.
You certainly can't will things into existence. Can't buy an HTC phone and wish into existence some drivers that it never had in the first place.
As much as I would like video acceleration, I'm not sure where it is that HTC specifically stated their would be some. GPS, pushmail, Pocket IE, it all pretty much works as expected. I understand that the qualcomm chipset may certainly be capable of video acceleration, but that doesn't mean that it was a specific feature that HTC was going after when it made the Kaiser.
I'm not trying to ruin anyones plans or desires to get the most out of their phones, but why not just not buy the phone?
I for one look forward to something like Android, so hobbiests and consumers can put the features they want to exploit in to place on phones like the Kaiser. I hope this drastically changes the market and gives us more choice in our software, and forces manufacturers to do more than the bare minimum with these devices.
-James

jmacdonald801 said:
As much as I would like video acceleration, I'm not sure where it is that HTC specifically stated their would be some.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, given older HTC devices never mentioned video acceleration in their specs either and that they're certainly performing better than the Kaiser, I think it's fair to expect performance which at the very least matches that of former models.

I got my Kaiser as a Tilt from AT&T. I had 30 days to return it. I was given ample opportunity to play with it, install software, and make my complaint. I kept the device. No one was being forced to buy these things...
...As much as I would like video acceleration, I'm not sure where it is that HTC specifically stated their would be some. GPS, pushmail, Pocket IE, it all pretty much works as expected. I understand that the qualcomm chipset may certainly be capable of video acceleration, but that doesn't mean that it was a specific feature that HTC was going after when it made the Kaiser.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hate to say it, but jmac makes very good points. Awareness is fine. Negative publicity might cause some action. but such a lawsuit isn't very winnable here since there were no real explicit promises broken here. Any "promises borken" were more hopes and expectations that were not made by the manufacturer.
But who knows, this being a very HTC centric forum, it could make them take a little notice, but most likely this isn't a winnable case.

jomo25 said:
I hate to say it, but jmac makes very good points. Awareness is fine. Negative publicity might cause some action. but such a lawsuit isn't very winnable here since there were no real explicit promises broken here. Any "promises borken" were more hopes and expectations that were not made by the manufacturer.
But who knows, this being a very HTC centric forum, it could make them take a little notice, but most likely this isn't a winnable case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hehe, as stated elsewhere, it's mostly a pressure and publicity tool. In the end, if we do do the case, it doesn't even really matter if we win it. The publicity and awareness it will generate... There's the headology factor. People are happy using a gadget. People learn the gadget can do a lot more then it does. People are unhappy using the gadget. People complain about the gadget. Creator of gadget fixes gadget
Mark my words, if enough attention is given to this, HTC will do the right thing, if only to save face.

Great site so far Chainfire. I pray that this brings enough attention to move HTC to action. Without those drivers, I can compare this to buying a Corvette only to realize once on the road that the governor is set to 30mph.

Satus update
Status update:
The site is almost finished and uploaded, apart from the "Responses from HTC" section.
- Please read the 'drivers in detail' page and tell me what you think
- Please help me collect 'carrier branded' names of the devices in question
I have also setup a paypal address for donations for the AdWords campaign only, you can find a button on the "What you can do" page. I already put 100 euro's in there myself, and it's been getting extra visitors for almost an hour now.
Before I finish the "Responses from HTC" part, start submitting to slashdot, digg, etc, it's time for dinner

you might want to add the htc vogue/sprint touch to your list on htcclassaction.org, it suffers the same problem and i believe it has a similar chipset with the same 3d hardware.
i think htc will just say,well just because the chipset we use has 3d hardware built in doesn't mean we have to enable or support it because it was never advertised as such.

I'd have to download and extract a ROM to be sure though, I'll do that later.

jmacdonald801 said:
I don't understand the point of this petition, or a law suite for that matter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What he said...but I am a little under the influence right now. To be honest, my phone works for GPS, works for email, works for web browsing, sync's via activesync, plays movies just fine (no slider issues when adjusting sound), allows me to read ebooks, works with office mobile (though I would like to be able to save Word documents as .DOC files, not .DOCX). Guess I'm with the 99% because I really don't see any issues with the phone that cause me to get on a soapbox. I really don't care if this makes me unpopular, but I'm so sick of people coming on this forum and moaning about video driver issues. Show me one other device that does all the things that a Kaiser can do? iPhone, no GPS and limited open source unless you want to run the risk of bricking the device, Nokia? Please, I had the 9xxx series of communicators for years. I had the choice between the latest comunicator series or the Kaiser, I went with the Kaiser as Symbian sucked. The N95, QWERTY keyboard???
This phone is not designed as a graphics device, its a business tool. If you want DVD quality movies, buy a portable DVD player, graphic intensive games, get a PSP. I have a Nokia 2110 mobile from 10 years ago that can't handle MID files, a Garmin Sat-Nav the size of a house brick and a digital camera that uses 3.5" floppy discs cause memory cards hadn't been invented when it was launched. HTC have packed an MP3 player, sat-nav, laptop computer, digital camera, mobile phone (...the list goes on) inside a device the size of a packet of cigarettes. Personally I think this is amazing, lets give them a bit of credit for doing this!
[/drunk rant off...]

Vote For Kaiser ... Gadget of the Year

I know what problems everyone is facing... Due to Improper Video Drivers and all but despite being laggy on some Video Playback and all... i Love my Kaiser and i already voted for it ...
Go ahead Support This device ... I know many of you Love this device.. so go ahead vote for it ... NO REGISTRATION REQUIRED
Remember to VOTE IN TWO CATEGORIES
Gadget of the year
Smart phone of the year
http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/20/vote-for-the-2007-engadget-awards/

Sticky this thread please.
I know we all have had issues with the Kaiser but its still a good phone and with HTC now coming alongside with a possible solution it should beat the Nokia N85!!!!!!

I wont vote for it without drivers..

Are you kidding me? Yeah. Let HTC think we're all happy with this phone! (sarcasm)
Sure, I'll admit the phone works great for my uses, but they still dropped the ball.

No surprise, the iPhone wins even though it doesn't qualify as a smartphone (engadget knows that). Also voted for Apple TV as worst.

bshakil said:
I know what problems everyone is facing... Due to Improper Video Drivers and all but despite being laggy on some Video Playback and all... i Love my Kaiser and i already voted for it ...
Go ahead Support This device ... I know many of you Love this device.. so go ahead vote for it ... NO REGISTRATION REQUIRED
Remember to VOTE IN TWO CATEGORIES
Gadget of the year
Smart phone of the year
http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/20/vote-for-the-2007-engadget-awards/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Certainly, just after they provide drivers that utilized the MSM 7200 on die ATI hardware acceleration with direct draw functions, and NOT a debugged version of the current 3D implementation of the software that runs on main processor.
"You can't have any pudding if you don't eat your meat... How can you have your pudding if you don't eat your meat...?"
?Glitch

That entire contest is one big collective circle-jerk for the engadget readers to confirm to themselves how superior they think apple is. Key word being "think". In every category that an apple product is nominated for, apple is winning. EVERY one. It doesn't matter if there are other products that are better, the voters are ignorant.
Example: For Peripheral of the year, the apple keyboard is winning. There are at least 3 other peripherals on the list that are more innovative and better products. I think the Belkin network USB hub should win, but bc apple puts out a thin keyboard, everyone bends over.

marm0lade said:
That entire contest is one big collective circle-jerk for the engadget readers to confirm to themselves how superior they think apple is. Key word being "think". In every category that an apple product is nominated for, apple is winning. EVERY one. It doesn't matter if there are other products that are better, the voters are ignorant.
Example: For Peripheral of the year, the apple keyboard is winning. There are at least 3 other peripherals on the list that are more innovative and better products. I think the Belkin network USB hub should win, but bc apple puts out a thin keyboard, everyone bends over.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats because most people don't realize the capablities of what PPC's can do man.. It's honestly not their fault. As normal default our phones vs Iphone, no offense mate. Iphone rips this **** to shreds..
And I am only talking about OUT OF THE BOX default...
But if we're talking about people like us, who know about technology, and understand the capabilities of what a PPC can do. Then yes, obviously the PPC kills, crush, destroys any other phone..
You gotta remember, majority of people don't know **** about technology.. You shouldn't hold it against them, honestly they can't be bothered to learn, it isn't their hobby. its ours.

Nooo don't do it!
Whilst I love my Kaiser, I can only see this being detrimental to all of the good work over at htcclassaction.
I'm not one of these people who state they wouldn't ever buy another HTC phone, the video issue doesn't really bite at me that much and personally, it's the best phone I've ever owned. I'd never admit that to HTC because it's not all that it should be. Now if they release proper drivers, I'll vote for it
marm0lade; said:
That entire contest is one big collective circle-jerk for the engadget readers to confirm to themselves how superior they think apple is. Key word being "think". In every category that an apple product is nominated for, apple is winning. EVERY one. It doesn't matter if there are other products that are better, the voters are ignorant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That depends on who is voting really, if it's consumer, then they bought the product, they experienced it and felt one way or another about it. If they feel inclined to vote it as best 'whatever' of the year and apple wins, then surely apple is superior, their product may or may not be but thats just a matter of opinion really.
I apple is like Marmite, you either love it or hate it (and if you really feel strongly about that go here http://www.marmite.com/ ).
Thats just my two pence worth anyway

Kepela523 said:
You gotta remember, majority of people don't know **** about technology.. You shouldn't hold it against them, honestly they can't be bothered to learn, it isn't their hobby. its ours.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMAO, true, true. I don't know about can't be bothered though, don't need to I think is more accurate. For most people these things do just what they want them to. They look flashy and all of their mates go "Wow, thats cool. I want one of those", another Happy customer.

bshakil said:
I know what problems everyone is facing... Due to Improper Video Drivers and all but despite being laggy on some Video Playback and all... i Love my Kaiser and i already voted for it ...
Go ahead Support This device ... I know many of you Love this device.. so go ahead vote for it ... NO REGISTRATION REQUIRED
Remember to VOTE IN TWO CATEGORIES
Gadget of the year
Smart phone of the year
http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/20/vote-for-the-2007-engadget-awards/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why should I vote for something that is slower than my old 8125?
The only advantage of the kaiser is the gps...

marm0lade said:
. It doesn't matter if there are other products that are better, the voters are ignorant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds like you describe the voting system in the U.S.! ;-)
I agree, Apple's products always have a cult following and Apple always shows up as #1. Perhaps they are #1 for buyers, but the products never seem to align with my needs. A locked phone that requires jailbreaks and other underhanded tactics to use is nothing but a pretty brick to me.
Also the Asus EEEPC or whatever, that looks like a small factor laptop not a mobile phone. Does that thing even support GSM networks? Why is that in there?
I'm unhappy with my Kaiser performance, but still happy I have it. I voted for Kaiser, because the iPhone and that EEEPC is a brick for me.

jon_k said:
I agree, Apple's products always have a cult following and Apple always shows up as #1. Perhaps they are #1 for buyers, but the products never seem to align with my needs. A locked phone that requires jailbreaks and other underhanded tactics to use is nothing but a pretty brick to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does that apply to SIM/CID unlocking, ROM ripping too? How many of us on here are actually using stock unmodified phones?

Oooh... it was tough deciding between my Asus eee and my Tilt... but I voted for tilt XD
Only downside is Engadget (as much as I love it and read it everyday) is Apple-Fan Center. Good Luck fighting them fanboys :S
Every apple product is leading "positive" awards =S

Is there a category for "Fraud of the Year"? If so, I vote for the Kaiser.

Leaving TyTN II & leaving HTC FOREVER

Hi Guys,
This is probably the best PDA forum. HTC should pay all you guys for creating this great forum for its overrated mobile.
TyTN II was the most $ I have ever spent on a mobile. With the price I pay, I could get a decent dual core laptop. But I wanted all things in one gadget and the news on TyTN II prior to its launch have made this mobile my dream mobile.
I was weary of the slow CPU speed. But after reading Qualcomm's specification of its CPU, that it is a dual core chip, I forced myself to believe that it will be faster than my old PDA that runs on Intel PXA270, 416MHZ. Unfortunately, I was mislead.
Sure, the TyTN II is stable, but I need to wait for 1-2 secs for it to register my command and than to react is totally not acceptable, especially I paid so much $ for it.
As for the Video, the first time I experienced, at best, the still moving pictures from an avi file had caused me great concern that my TyTn II is faulty. But now we all know that that phone is working under perfectly fine condition. Seriously, who has time to encode avi file down so that it can be viewed on TyTn II. I brought this phone to assist me and make my life more convenient, not the opposite.
So finally, I am trading in this phone at 64% of its original price (I have only used this phone for 5 months) for either Asus P750 or Gsmart MS800. I have ordered both of these new phones with the store for inspection and to make my final decision.
I am also frustrated with its inability to record telephone calls, which is one of necessary function for my job. I have spoken to a HTC sales and he told me that it is for privacy reason that they have make such a restriction. This is a load of BS. All large phone companies such as Nokia, SE, LG, and Moto have such a function.
Hope that I will also be able to find a native forum as good as this for Asus P750 or Gsmart MS800.
AND, I will never (during my time on earth) buy another HTC phone again... and I will certainly spread the word to all my friends not to buy any HTC phone either. HTC is good at make its first time customer its last time customer.
Guys, seriously, do you still believe that there is hope for the video driver or video improvement for HTC???

Get a life. Good luck with your new phone. Maybe they will have the video drivers you are looking for. We need to make a Sub Forum called "People Who ***** About HTC Products and Video Drivers"

goodbye, enjoy your new phone
honestly if anyone is tired of their kaiser, pls just sell it and leave, no need to whine about it or say goodbye. we really wont miss you at all.
all of us still holding on to our kaisers may be stupid from ur point of view, but we are all trying to make it work, hence the name xda-developers, not xda-whiners. if you dont like ur kaiser, sure you are entitled to your opinion, but ppl who choose to stay, dont really care, so just sell of your phone, piss off, and dont bother anyone. we dont really care to know what you feel about your device

well thx for telling us how u feel but we dont really care...its not like we're gonna follow suit cuz of u...research or try it out before u spend "so much $" on it...and whether new drivers are coming...who knows maybe or maybe not...this phone being not suitable to u doesnt mean it sucks or its bad in any way...just go get ur phone which suits u best...and live on

well... what more can I say..?
bye bye...

FYI, it's 'wary', not 'weary'. Good luck.

Seems like you want someone to sympathize. Pick one of the following responses:
1. Awww poor baby. There there.
2. I'll join you in abandoning HTC products.
(disclaimer: meh)

Good luck. and hope you can find the right PDA.

Tell it Wayne...
One whiner less....
This is nothing personal, but people are tired of new whining threads... plz just go and leave us alone with the whining.
If your friends belive the $ you talk it's their problem. Noone here cares if your friends like HTC or not. It doesn't matter for most if HTC sales some phones less or not. I still dont geht the point of such threads...
U think HTC will read this? U think it gets better if you buy a new one? Sry but every phones has it's issues... everything... here it is a video driver, other phones als cheaply manufactured, some have other bugs. There is nothing perfect. So wake up! The world is unfair.

Guys I am sorry but there is someone who tells us what he is doing now.
I believe HTC will never release the new drivers and at least they should see that people are selling the device now and will buy other brand in the future.
HP h4150 (best device I ever had)
Magican (it was fantastic but not that fast as the h4150)
TyTn1 (was ****)
Trinity (same **** like TyTn1, color pealing blahh blahh. but at least smaller)
now this stupid Kaiser (good device but not ready for the market)
I have bought 4 devices from HTC and only one was that what I am expecting to get.
And now you Guys are blaming him because he tells in a open letter what he will do?
Nice one!

HTC cheaters
I agree with the first post of this thread.
lot of people are addicted to flashing roms (me too), the fact that Kaiser is a disaster will never be acknowledged bec we have paid good amount for this and we refuse to give up or accept the facts. Till how long, will this go on. when will HTC be made to change their attitude, an attitude of taking consumers for granted, show me any hardware of their's which is perfect, either the speaker or camera will let u down. people who have criticized the first post should realise that people didnt go out to buy a phone with bad camera, speaker and display issues. Fact is we all have been duped by HTC. and if people here think things can be solved by xda everytime so lets buy htc, then its not right. I hope someday XDA dev manufacture a great phone , probably it will be the perfect phone.

gqstatus0685 said:
Get a life. Good luck with your new phone. Maybe they will have the video drivers you are looking for. We need to make a Sub Forum called "People Who ***** About HTC Products and Video Drivers"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unnecessary! It's a forum for people to voice their opinions and thats all he was doing. Fine, if you don't agree with his post, thats up to you but it's like my parents used to tell me "If you don't have anything nice to say.... don't say anything at all"
This is kind of one of the reasons why I try not to post here too much. Too many people all wanting to jump down someones throat when they disagree with a post, r the reason for posting. It's not just here, it's the same with any forum you go to. It's sad really.

Even though you think he's whining, it doesn't get better with the negative answers you give him. He just tells us he's made a choice.
The rudeness to him in the following posts is not worthy of an xda-developer.
Stay friendly.

viewedit said:
I agree with the first post of this thread.
lot of people are addicted to flashing roms (me too), the fact that Kaiser is a disaster will never be acknowledged bec we have paid good amount for this and we refuse to give up or accept the facts. Till how long, will this go on. when will HTC be made to change their attitude, an attitude of taking consumers for granted, show me any hardware of their's which is perfect, either the speaker or camera will let u down. people who have criticized the first post should realise that people didnt go out to buy a phone with bad camera, speaker and display issues. Fact is we all have been duped by HTC. and if people here think things can be solved by xda everytime so lets buy htc, then its not right. I hope someday XDA dev manufacture a great phone , probably it will be the perfect phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ag, shamepies,
Maybe HTC will provide live feeds from Mars too.
Or maybe better yet, a device that will record your blood pressure and hot & cold running water at the same time!
Oh, maybe even better, a device that will also double as a BMI scale and also have a built-in HIV monitor and blood-group detector!!!
Grow up!!
This has truly become the Cheese & WHINE forum!!!

MACkjam said:
Ag, shamepies,
Maybe HTC will provide live feeds from Mars too.
Or maybe better yet, a device that will record your blood pressure and hot & cold running water at the same time!
Oh, maybe even better, a device that will also double as a BMI scale and also have a built-in HIV monitor and blood-group detector!!!
Grow up!!
This has truly become the Cheese & WHINE forum!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What is YOUR contribution to xda-developers exactly?

even if i dont't mind if anybody has a kaiser, sells a kaiser, buys a kaiser or sleeps with his kaiser, i think such threads might not be useless.
if many people make it clear that they leave HTC and why they sell their phones maybe HTC realizes that their way to treat customers was wrong.

rhov23 said:
What is YOUR contribution to xda-developers exactly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Firstly, I've helped a few people here and there. Secondly I've been here a little longer than you even if I haven't posted much.
And yours???

MACkjam said:
Firstly, I've helped a few people here and there. Secondly I've been here a little longer than you even if I haven't posted much.
And yours???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well length of membership really isn't anything to go by, I could have signed up to be a member yesterday and could be a total guru (im not though )
Look, lets just play nice ok? Its a public forum for people to publish their opinions. Lets not turn this into yet another bashing thread.

foobar1977 said:
Well length of membership really isn't anything to go by, I could have signed up to be a member yesterday and could be a total guru (im not though )
Look, lets just play nice ok? Its a public forum for people to publish their opinions. Lets not turn this into yet another bashing thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree. Thanks

MACkjam said:
Firstly, I've helped a few people here and there. Secondly I've been here a little longer than you even if I haven't posted much.
And yours???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Made iTask, and made a lot of skins for various programs.

iphone killer app

I'm looking for the one (or better more than 1) app that will kick all the surrounding iphone addicts and will get them to see that the kaiser is not failing even with graphics and interface. I think that a game that takes the graphics to the the limit will do the job - any suggestions?

You don't need any software to do that; it already does.
iPhone users can't figure out how to use these types of phones, you need to be intelligent too, and, well, Apple users really aren't that intelligent...

The Iphone is sooo cute.......It's amazing how impressed people get with what are nothing but a bunch of shortcuts on the phone, You can't do everything you can on WM

If you are looking to get justification from me (or someone else) about the $$ you spent on the kaiser (vs. iphone), then you obviously missed the point.
p.s. you probably should have just asked what the best software was--instead of "why is my 1 year old phone better than the iphone"
p.p.s. maybe you should have bought an iphone. you might be one of the people Squeaky369 was talking about.
...of course, it sounds like he's trying to justify the kaiser also.
Here's my $0.02:
I used to only own sony ericsson phones. until I bought an Audiovox SMT5600. cool phone, but it just needed a "insert newest feature here," to be perfect. Then the next HTC phone came out, and, viola! I bought that one. fast forward through 6 HTC phones in as ~4 years.
I like them because they have great support by the folks here at xda-developers. THAT's enough for me. Customer support, only provided by people who actually care, the customer.
to sum it all up, the kaiser is only a good phone because of this website.

Squeaky369 said:
You don't need any software to do that; it already does.
iPhone users can't figure out how to use these types of phones, you need to be intelligent too, and, well, Apple users really aren't that intelligent...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that's the the hardest point: make the non intelligent understand that they are such.

pingels said:
If you are looking to get justification from me (or someone else) about the $$ you spent on the kaiser (vs. iphone), then you obviously missed the point.
p.s. you probably should have just asked what the best software was--instead of "why is my 1 year old phone better than the iphone"
p.p.s. maybe you should have bought an iphone. you might be one of the people Squeaky369 was talking about.
...of course, it sounds like he's trying to justify the kaiser also.
Here's my $0.02:
I used to only own sony ericsson phones. until I bought an Audiovox SMT5600. cool phone, but it just needed a "insert newest feature here," to be perfect. Then the next HTC phone came out, and, viola! I bought that one. fast forward through 6 HTC phones in as ~4 years.
I like them because they have great support by the folks here at xda-developers. THAT's enough for me. Customer support, only provided by people who actually care, the customer.
to sum it all up, the kaiser is only a good phone because of this website.
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You totally missed me: If I could get iphone for $100 less than what i have payed for my kaiser (and maybe I could - i just didnt look for) I would never got an apple,
I am more than proud to have my kaiser and I bought it after reading this website for long time and understanding that powerful machine with power web support is what I need. for me the apple is like a toy for spoiled users, but I do find myself many times trying to justify my choice.

udi1 said:
I'm looking for the one (or better more than 1) app that will kick all the surrounding iphone addicts and will get them to see that the kaiser is not failing even with graphics and interface. I think that a game that takes the graphics to the the limit will do the job - any suggestions?
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Anywho, Skyfire. Nuff said. Load it up enabled HSDPA on your phone and head to anysite playing video. I watched that new Chris Rock special on my phone today at work, had the entire crew laughing.

when sanchez get his program out, then you can show them your phone can do everything the iphone does. just showing how customizable it is should do the trick

c'mon man...you already got them with copy and paste!

udi1 said:
I'm looking for the one (or better more than 1) app that will kick all the surrounding iphone addicts and will get them to see that the kaiser is not failing even with graphics and interface. I think that a game that takes the graphics to the the limit will do the job - any suggestions?
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dude, you don't need any special application. just copy and paste and they'll run off crying like little girls

Just show them a cursory list of WM apps/games available for the TyTN II and that'll scare them sh*tless!!!! Nevermind the Java stuff too.
Just show them how customisable the TyTN II is also,
and and and and and...the list is almost endles!!!
I have a thread here somewhere where I had a device shoot-out with a colleague a few months back. He has (had now hehehehehe) an Apple iPhoney and I have my TyTN II....he ran for the hills dude!!!!!!!!

Show them Manila 2D
I wowed an iPhone user when I showed them my tilt with M2D running. What's up with youtube on iPhone looking like crap? LOL

kaiser VS. iphone
hey.
no dought. iphone is like a simple video game, and kaiser is like a small computer with all the posebilities-just think of one...
in every compresion i read, the kaiser took the iphone by far.
be proud to have a kaiser. a fantastic machine indeed. let the childrens play with their iphones

Are you expecting somebody to say "there was a guy with an iphone, and i pulled out my kaiser and showed him my latest program. his girlfriend left him for me and gave me a lot of money. then i asked him about copying and pasting and he grabbed his groin because my metaphorical kick actually caused him pain."

Funny, cbass.
No, but there is a joy to all of this. It's not about who's swinging the bigger stick. It's just that some iPhone owners are so ridiculous about their phones (while most of the iPhone owners I know already have either broken the screen or just traded them in.)
A buddy of mine lives 3000 miles away. I called him up to let him know I was visiting. Knowing he's a gadget geek, I asked if he had the new 3G iPhone. He did. He asked if I had it. I said "No, I bought the Tilt." He laughed and told me about three coworkers who bought Tilts and hated them. How ugly the screens were. How impractical. I kept my mouth shut knowing I had just put TouchFlo 2d on the Tilt and wanted to wait for him to see it in person. Now I have a buddy who is pissed he bought an iPhone.
P.S. I don't know where you guys bought your Kaisers. I bought mine from AT&T (refurbished, not that you could tell) for $150.

A horse that had just purchased an iPhone walked into a bar...bartender asked, "Why the long face?"
Thank you, thank you...
Just go to an iPhone owner, put your tilt up to their face, and ask, "Can your fancy phone DO THIS!!!" as you slide out the keyboard to the transformers sound they will have no other choice but to rip their garment apart and gnash their teeth in repentance...

This is the funniest thread ever!

deymayor said:
This is the funniest thread ever!
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iphone killer thread... should be stickied!!

No offense, but there is no comparison
I'm not saying iPhone is better, but that there really is no comparison.
The point of the iPhone is to be slick, simple, and easy to use. According to the vast user community, it meets those objectives. My VP buddy has the iPhone and so do most of the execs at our company now. The reason they like it is that it just "does what they want", and nothing more.
I tell the 1st buddy I mentioned about all the cool things my phone does, and he says "I don't need that". End of argument. I ask if this or that on the iPhone is configurable. He doesn't want to configure it.
When asked about the user interface, he says "They nailed it", meaning it is perfect. He doesn't need a slide-out keyboard, because the on-screen keyboard works just fine for him. No... He probably can't type as fast as I can on the Tilt, but he says "I don't need to type fast".
So there it is: The iPhone community (and it is growing) are guys that are not stupid.. their world just does not revolve around their phone as ours does. It isn't a toy to make better -- it is a tool.
An iPhone killer is a stripped down, simple, rudimentary version of the software I have now. It is so stripped down that it probably works a bit more reliably and a bit more spritely in responding to commands. It also has one more feature -- consistency of user interface. It can't "dump to the same old e-mail interface" when you just came off the slick screen. It still has to zoom and flip and do all that. iFonz was close, but the version I used wasn't very fast on the Kaiser. And to me (I'm one of you -- make no mistake) it didn't do all I wanted! (so I have to disqualify myself on that point... )
Someone should make that slick simple phone -- oh, they do --- but we wouldn't like it...
So it is about market. In my opinion, Apple knows how to mass market to people -- not engineers -- and HTC and MS know how to market to engineers. Unfortunately, people outnumber engineers by a considerable margin.

esnyder58 said:
I'm not saying iPhone is better, but that there really is no comparison.
The point of the iPhone is to be slick, simple, and easy to use. According to the vast user community, it meets those objectives. My VP buddy has the iPhone and so do most of the execs at our company now. The reason they like it is that it just "does what they want", and nothing more.
I tell the 1st buddy I mentioned about all the cool things my phone does, and he says "I don't need that". End of argument. I ask if this or that on the iPhone is configurable. He doesn't want to configure it.
When asked about the user interface, he says "They nailed it", meaning it is perfect. He doesn't need a slide-out keyboard, because the on-screen keyboard works just fine for him. No... He probably can't type as fast as I can on the Tilt, but he says "I don't need to type fast".
So there it is: The iPhone community (and it is growing) are guys that are not stupid.. their world just does not revolve around their phone as ours does. It isn't a toy to make better -- it is a tool.
An iPhone killer is a stripped down, simple, rudimentary version of the software I have now. It is so stripped down that it probably works a bit more reliably and a bit more spritely in responding to commands. It also has one more feature -- consistency of user interface. It can't "dump to the same old e-mail interface" when you just came off the slick screen. It still has to zoom and flip and do all that. iFonz was close, but the version I used wasn't very fast on the Kaiser. And to me (I'm one of you -- make no mistake) it didn't do all I wanted! (so I have to disqualify myself on that point... )
Someone should make that slick simple phone -- oh, they do --- but we wouldn't like it...
So it is about market. In my opinion, Apple knows how to mass market to people -- not engineers -- and HTC and MS know how to market to engineers. Unfortunately, people outnumber engineers by a considerable margin.
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Actually alot of them do revolve around there phones..... they are materialistic about it alot of times. if apple can put their name on it they will buy it.
I would have to say it is a opinion though. just over a year ago people were amazed when i had a phone with a touch screen. now they don't hardly make phones without them. People are used to having a phone that did only the basic functions and anything more than that is over whelming to them to have much more than simple.
Reguardless it really is an inteligence thing. people are intimidated by carrying around a computer in their pocket and yet i can tell them they are amazed everytme they see my phone after i have flashed a new rom "its like a having a new phone everytime" I've actually talked about 10 different people into gettng this phone in the last 6 months reguardsless that its "death" is schedulled at the end of this year. I'm maitaing a fleet of kaisers and training windows mobile users. They all were confused when they got them but about all you have to say is it runs just like windows and all the sudden it gets easier and easier.......
One thing i can say is noone i have ever talked to after i show them around to all the things they can do and how to use them have ever gone, "damn i shouldn't have gotten this phone." they all go off to flaunt it to their iphone friends.

PLEASE - I NEED HELP JAILBREAKING MY iPHONE 3GS!!!

JUST KIDDING!!! I will NEVER own an iPhone of any generation - PERIOD!!
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Hyperplasia07_from_youtube said:
I have bought all three generations of iPhones on launch day, but I cannot take it any longer.
In the end, it was rejection of Google Voice from the App Store that drove me to this point, but that was just the tip of the spear. Whether it is their refusal to let other gadgets such as the Palm Pre interface with iTunes, or their Draconian App Store procedures...I simply cannot support them with a clear conscience, which is why I chose to end the life of my iPhone in this manner instead of selling it--after all, who would want to pass on a cancer to another person?
Apple may have fooled the world with their witty commercials and bright t-shirts, but they will no longer fool me. Their approach has helped them gain a sizable chunk of the PC market, but as their popularity grows, people will begin to see them for what they really are--a corporation far more "evil" than Microsoft would ever dream to be.
Apple is turning consumerism into communism. Any entity that enforces such anti-competitive practices and dictates what their paying population can and cannot have without any explanation, consistency, or reason is communistic. It's wrong and I will no longer support it.
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Haha well, i dont mind spreading the "cancer," im reselling my iphone
And i dont hate the iphone, i just dont like it or apple anymore...

You know, it actually held up better than I thought it would in that video

Da_G said:
You know, it actually held up better than I thought it would in that video
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Ha! I know right? I would have figured the first round would have blown it to pieces but no.... It took 4 before the phone even broke in half!

Went on the rounds not so long ago via faceplant/twit the music really sets the scenario

Congrats, must feel good

Insane...LoL...but great stress relief
Seriously, I hope this guy doesn't take this to another step...and start shooting a apple store or even worst

Now I'd like to see "50cal V. iPad"

Those Foxconn workers may be suicidal, but the build a tough phone

The title should be "PLEASE HELP THIS LAME PHONE MAKE SOME FRIENDS!"

AGAIN!!! AGAIN!!! The iphone does make a good target.

Thought this was brilliant when I watched it, music really does set the scene!
How many times do you reckon the guy missed? Or is he a better shot then I would be if I ever touched a gun....