Database Develop

Rooted vs unlocked bootloader

If I understand correctly every phone can be rooted (eventually) and only have the bootloader unlocked if it is not signed (there may be a work around, but not yet done/discovered).
So If the DX is signed and is rooted, what can't we do that having the bootloader unlocked would let us? I know loading an entire custom rom is one example. I am trying to see what the handicap "really" means to us in terms of what we can/can't change.
Personally if it will be rooted and that allows side-loading, custom themes, etc and loading a clean rom is the only thing we have to live without then that is something I can probably deal with and get the phone.
Any help explaining the distinction specifically would be great.

I posted this in another forum. I though it might help explain things.
sic004 said:
Let me try to make some basic comparisons using Windows OS as an example....
Rooting is simply getting access to the device's system as a "Super User" or SU. Think of it like an Administrator vs regular user on Windows. There are a lot of rudimentary things in Windows that you can only do as an Admin. Getting root access on a phone does allow you to add, modify, and delete things that a regular user cannot do. This will probably allow you to modify the theme to some extent, over clock the processor, add "unauthorized" programs, etc, etc, etc.
Having unrestricted access to the bootloader allows a user to load completely new ROMs. It would be like a Windows XP user installing a new OS like a super customized verson of XP, or upgrading to Windows7, or moving to Linux, or any other OS, etc, etc, etc.
The (suspected) problem with the Droid X bootloader is that it will only accept digitally signed ROMs from Motorola. So if Moto releases Froyo (which they have already annouced), then you can upgrade to that without problems (like going from XP to Windows7). What you cannot do is use the bootloader to install any other ROM that hasn't been officially released from Moto for the Droid X.
Is it something to worry about? I guess that depends on what you planned to do with your phone. If you are a "stock" phone kind of person, then you have nothing to worry about. Even if you wanted the ability to root and play around with some changes, you probably have nothing to worry about. But if you are a hard core "tweaker" that loves to push the envelop, or if you are worried about Moto dropping support for the Droid X (it will happen one day) and you want the ability to use customized ROMs, then this probably isn't the phone for you.
Hopefully this helps explain a little better the situation we face with the Droid X (at least as we know it today).
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The other thing is that I wanted to clarify what the "digitally signed" bootloader means. Sometimes I've said things that are not really that clear....
A bootloader can be designed so that it checks and only allow properly digitally signed ROMs from being loaded. Some bootloaders do not have this "digitally signed" requirement and will load up any ROM. It is expected that the bootloader on the Droid X is one that will only work with digitally signed ROMs with Motorola's digital signature on them.
This means that only official Droid X ROMs released by Motorola itself will work on the device.
I hope that helps.

sic0048 said:
I posted this in another forum. I though it might help explain things.
The other thing is that I wanted to clarify what the "digitally signed" bootloader means. Sometimes I've said things that are not really that clear....
A bootloader can be designed so that it checks and only allow properly digitally signed ROMs from being loaded. Some bootloaders do not have this "digitally signed" requirement and will load up any ROM. It is expected that the bootloader on the Droid X is one that will only work with digitally signed ROMs with Motorola's digital signature on them.
This means that only official Droid X ROMs released by Motorola itself will work on the device.
I hope that helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It helps a lot, much simpler than I thought. As long as I can tweak the phone I'll be happy, essentially that's what I flashed WinMo devices for, latest OS and custom apps. I'll hope we'll get Android 3 / Gingerbread for this device at some point after it is released end of year and assume that'll be the last major update. While it would be nice to load custom roms that are free of bloat and add in common apps, I can get by with just rooting it sounds like.
Thanks.

rolandroland said:
It helps a lot, much simpler than I thought. As long as I can tweak the phone I'll be happy, essentially that's what I flashed WinMo devices for, latest OS and custom apps. I'll hope we'll get Android 3 / Gingerbread for this device at some point after it is released end of year and assume that'll be the last major update. While it would be nice to load custom roms that are free of bloat and add in common apps, I can get by with just rooting it sounds like.
Thanks.
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I pray each and every night for a Root to the Droid X!!!

Please this needs to be rooted so I can hulk smash my eris and go buy one!

will a rooted-only droid x allow the user to change things such as the notification bar color? how about fonts or text colors? i much prefer the HTC black bar over the stock android white one. thanks in advance!

kheovnien said:
will a rooted-only droid x allow the user to change things such as the notification bar color? how about fonts or text colors? i much prefer the HTC black bar over the stock android white one. thanks in advance!
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yes, I am 99.9% sure that you can using adb to push a different notification bar with custom colors and icons.

paul89 said:
yes, I am 99.9% sure that you can using adb to push a different notification bar with custom colors and icons.
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So then MetaMorph should work then, right?

Yes metamorphosis should work as long as nand. Is unlocked. But that's still not enough for me I need my custom roms etc changing the look does nothing for performance

bizzshow26 said:
Yes metamorphosis should work as long as nand. Is unlocked. But that's still not enough for me I need my custom roms etc changing the look does nothing for performance
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No, I agree. I have been spoiled on the Eris and would never go back to a "regular" phone again. This just saved me spending $300 Thur, lol. I will just wait until its unlocked and rooted. And if it isnt, tons of other phones to chose from.
Good luck to the devs working on this.

Can't we use what they are using for the milestone and just work around the bootloader ?
Because they have custom roms and recovery

Questions about DroidX development.

Alright, I currently have an Incredible. I have yet to root it, because I'm thinking about using my 30 day satisfaction guarantee to switch for the DroidX. Now, from my understanding, root is essentially inevitable on all phones. However, the Incredible has custom ROMs available already, whereas from reading a thread elsewhere, it's looking like it will be nigh impossible to get custom ROMs for the DroidX? Is this true? Does that mean the Incredible is unsigned?
I was considering switching to the DroidX because of the bigger screen, better video and sound quality, among other reasons. Should I still consider this, or am I better off sticking with my Incredible?

The Inc. bootloader apparently will work with non-signed ROMs. Motorola has started to make their bootloaders check for a valid digital signature on any ROM it starts to load. If there is not a valid digital signature on the ROM, it won't load it. Therefore you cannot load a custom ROM with that type of bootloader. It hasn't been determined if the bootloader on the X will only work with digitally signed ROMs, but that is the expectation.
Whether or not you care depends on what you expect to do with the phone. Many people don't care to load custom ROMs. If the manufacturer keeps up with development, then the need for custom ROMs drops even further. There will always be those people that want to play around and tweak ROMs, but the general poplulation won't bother with ROMs.
It just depends on what you want to do.....

This is purely a guess... but I would venture to say the X will be rooted at some point. I'm basing this off the assumption nothing new is being implemented here. I can't imagine this phone is suddenly using some new technology that cannot be cracked.
But who knows. Only time will tell.

sic0048 said:
It just depends on what you want to do.....
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As I understand it, the Milestone is the only phone Motorola has locked down the ability to load unsigned roms. Is it also the only Android phone released by Motorola since the Droid? How can we know if this is something they simply decided to do after they released the Droid or if it was a one-off? I've read they said they will require signed roms on all future phones, but who knows. I thought the Droid was vanilla android, is the milestone not. If it runs without a manufacturer custom UI, what's the point of locking it down?
I dropped my iPhone in the lake a month ago, but was planning on replacing it in July with an Android phone anyway. I was waiting for the Evo, and now the Droid X but I don't think I can wait any longer without a phone. Reading all the reviews of the Droid X I've just ignored all critisism of the UI assuming I'd be able to throw vanilla Froyo on there within a few days when the community released something. This is really discouraging and sorry to say even with the Motorola UI I think it's still my best option. As a side rant, I know it's been said before, but I don't see how this is any different than buying a computer and not being allowed to put whatever OS I want on it as long as I can find drivers. It seems like the sort of thing the FTC would go after Dell or HP for doing, so why should smart-phones be any different, especially unsubsidized? In short, to answer your question, I'd like to not have the annoyance of feeling like MY hardware is being arbitrarily limited by the manufacturer, even if their custom android "does" everything I need it to.
What if you wanted to do development on your phone and not just virtual consoles on your computer. In a year or two is your only option going to be a designated development phone like the Nexus One? I can see why it has little effect on Motorola, people who care make up a very small percentage, but shouldn't Google care enough to step in and prevent Motorola from doing this?

Ok, I'm fairly new to all this, which leads me to my confusion on this issue. If we are worried about the bootloader, as with the milestone - no roms then what is this about?
[ROM][V0.3][28.06.2010] Senseui Mod for Milestone - xda-developers
Is he using a different version of milestone?

All im looking to do is get rid of the bloat apps that the X comes with. Even if we cant have custom roms, can this still be done? Im coming from an Omnia and i know the only way to get rid of the useless stuff was to flash. Does this work the same way with Android?
Yes Yes i have never had a Android phone before. Very excited about making the switch once the X is released

sjones765 said:
Ok, I'm fairly new to all this, which leads me to my confusion on this issue. If we are worried about the bootloader, as with the milestone - no roms then what is this about?
[ROM][V0.3][28.06.2010] Senseui Mod for Milestone - xda-developers
Is he using a different version of milestone?
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From what I understand, there's a[n experimental?] method to bypass the bootloader entirely on the milestone, and slip in a custom ROM that way. I think it's called kextern.
Mudvayne622 said:
All im looking to do is get rid of the bloat apps that the X comes with. Even if we cant have custom roms, can this still be done? Im coming from an Omnia and i know the only way to get rid of the useless stuff was to flash. Does this work the same way with Android?
Yes Yes i have never had a Android phone before. Very excited about making the switch once the X is released
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Once it's rooted, yes, you could easily do that. However if you don't like the psuedo-blur UI, there would be no way to get rid of that if the bootloader is encrypted.

Jyosua said:
However if you don't like the psuedo-blur UI, there would be no way to get rid of that if the bootloader is encrypted.
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Installing something like LauncherPro will go a long way towards removing the blur-like elements on the droidx. Getting rid of the motorola widgets and using a 3rd party launcher brings you fairly close to a stock android experience.

about DroidX development
The developer will need to CUSTOM make it for the EVO.

NinjaBlur Home on Motorola Droid?

Is there any possible way to port that BlurHome.apk in the Droid X dump to the Motorola Droid, I couldn't find it in the forums.

thepwneddroid said:
Is there any possible way to port that BlurHome.apk in the Droid X dump to the Motorola Droid, I couldn't find it in the forums.
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There is a way by most likely porting the whole build over. But I'm waiting for the droid2 to come out which is supposed to have ninjablur running on froyo. It should be a very easy port since it's basically an upgraded droid from what I've heard.

Ok, great. thanks for the reply.

zenulator said:
There is a way by most likely porting the whole build over. But I'm waiting for the droid2 to come out which is supposed to have ninjablur running on froyo. It should be a very easy port since it's basically an upgraded droid from what I've heard.
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so, now that the droid 2 is out, r u working on a rom?

if I may interject, that may be hard due to the locked bootloader, but stranger things have happened, though I do wonder what you find desirable in blur. Not meant to be rude, it's just that launcher pro payed has awsome homescreen widgets for social networks, and to my knowlede one of the main reasons people root is to rid their phones of forced upon software like blur. Though if it's really uninvasive, I guess I could see how that could be usefull. (oh, btw hardware changes all the time, just because its the droid 2, don't automatically think its an easy port to throw onto the D1) Did you know the Htc Incredible was originally supposed to have 8 gigs of rom, and, I believe like 2 gigs of ram, too. Though you see how that played out, slap the droid label on anything and you can sell about half the actual device to people at the same price, but I digress. Basically, if you really, really want this ported, make some developer friends online, ask nicely on the forums, or, you know, become a rom chef.

[Q] Moto Droid Bionic

I'm a verizon subscriber, with a droid eris, I can upgrade in March and this seem like the device I want to get my hands on. One thing I've been searching for and cannot seem to find is, is this stock android, very close to stock, or motoblur
Thanks for your help!

Unfortunately it will be running Motoblur. As far as I know there is only one phone on Verizon that runs stock Android: the original Motorola Droid. I have no idea why phone companies insist on mutating Android and making it worse with their crappy skins and proprietary apps. It angers me soo much. If I get the Bionic the first thing I will do is root it and install a stock Android ROM (if one exists). I hate Motoblur/Sense/whatever is running on LG and Samsung phones.

So it'll probably be similar to the version running on the Droid X then. That's decent. As long as it's not as intrusive as Devour's Blur. hahaha
And I hear you on that one, I have the Eris, thank goodness it's running Stock 2.2.1 instead of Sense 2.1, cause even though sense is the best skin out there, it's still full of bloatware and slows it down

Actually, it'll be running a new version of blur, or maybe they're not even going to call it blur. All I know is it's definitely not stock Android. From the videos I've seen, it actually looks very nice and isn't overwhelming. I prefer blur to sense, but stock Android to anything. Just search youtube for Motorola Bionic, there are plenty of videos out there of the interface in motion.

its motoblur sadly but apparently its a modified version that makes it more stock and less blur which is nice..the att atrix gets the full unmodified version of blur which is gonna suck

gee7201 said:
I'm a verizon subscriber, with a droid eris, I can upgrade in March and this seem like the device I want to get my hands on. One thing I've been searching for and cannot seem to find is, is this stock android, very close to stock, or motoblur
Thanks for your help!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would shoot for an HTC Thunderbolt with an AOSP ROM/Kernel.
Beamed from my DroidX

From what I've heard, it's running an updated version of Blur. It's supposedly much improved over even the Blur found on the D2/X. I've always preferred DroidBlur to Sense though, myself.
There's always the option of rooting and going stock though, so I wouldn't let Blur discourage you.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Benifits of rooting the bionic

Okay so i had the revo before this and i liked it. I rooted it and it was great, ran custom roms, and really easy to do. I just got the bionic and i have had it for about 2 weeks now and I LOVE IT!!! So my question is, and correct me if im wrong, if there are no custom kernels, and only one stable updated rom thats not buggy ics, what is the point in rooting. I should add that i dont plan on using wifi tether. I mean i use adw so my phone already "looks" like i want it to, and acts like i want it too. The only thing i think i would use is the fact that the bloatware is gone but does it really make that big of a difference? I mean if i can like make the display look better or something than of course, but if its just for the look, no performance upgrades, i dont seenthe point. Please give me your guys opinion.
Thanks for all who respond and appreciate your time

Lots of benefits to rooting. Here's a random one.

tuckmobile said:
Lots of benefits to rooting. Here's a random one.
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Yea I mean that's cool, what are the benefits of Beta over regular or a keyboard like touch pal.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using xda premium

Personally I haven't found the need to root my Bionic. Going on six months now I think. Had the Eris before this and rooted it to get a faster phone(Bionic is fast enough), to tether(Bionic can do it wired for free and wireless without root using FoxFi), to move apps to sd due to storage limitations (Bionic has plenty of room and lots of stuff can be saved or moved to sd). ROMs are a bonus, but they are always a work-in-progress and most being updated regular, so you always have to reinstall so more stuff will work. My Bionic just works.....................

Sir_Eagle said:
Personally I haven't found the need to root my Bionic. Going on six months now I think. Had the Eris before this and rooted it to get a faster phone(Bionic is fast enough), to tether(Bionic can do it wired for free and wireless without root using FoxFi), to move apps to sd due to storage limitations (Bionic has plenty of room and lots of stuff can be saved or moved to sd). ROMs are a bonus, but they are always a work-in-progress and most being updated regular, so you always have to reinstall so more stuff will work. My Bionic just works.....................
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I agree completely
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using xda premium

Lots of programs will have more functionality when your device is rooted. If you use a security program like SeekDroid or Avast you'll benefit from root. With root you can install custom recovery, allowing you to backup/restore your entire system. If you haven't tried a custom ROM you don't know what you're missing. Sure they are always a work in progress, but so is the Stock ROM. Try eclipse I bet you'll like it better.
Let's flip your question around: what's the disadvantage to rooting? You can always unroot.

Sir_Eagle said:
Personally I haven't found the need to root my Bionic. Going on six months now I think. Had the Eris before this and rooted it to get a faster phone(Bionic is fast enough), to tether(Bionic can do it wired for free and wireless without root using FoxFi), to move apps to sd due to storage limitations (Bionic has plenty of room and lots of stuff can be saved or moved to sd). ROMs are a bonus, but they are always a work-in-progress and most being updated regular, so you always have to reinstall so more stuff will work. My Bionic just works.....................
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Click to collapse
I'm rooted but use stock. I'm able to replace my boot animation with something more to my liking. My status and notification bar is also customized. Having pulldown toggles is nice for turning things on and off. Being able to flash the webtop hack is nice. I've also found that I enjoy changing my font.
Besides those things, its much easier to back up some apps when your rooted. If you ever buy any apps, I suggest backing them up. Being able to make system backups is also useful.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using XDA