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I have contacted BBC Watchdog (for those outside of UK - a consumer affairs watchdog that puts companies on the spot for mis-sold products) about the Blackberry update promised from O2 and how that ad for blackberry support has been removed with customer services saying there are no plans (despite what other people on this forum have said many times in the past) I would urge all other XDA IIs/i owners to do the same, if Watchdog get many of the same complaints - they will action it. We have to put O2 on the spot, enough is enough and it's time to bite back. This is what I sent:
I purchased an XDA IIi in February this year because O2 advertising said that a future rom update would allow me to pick up Blackberry emails. Since then and after many phone calls to their customers service departments, the new son the blackberry update has been withdrawn and customer services at O2 say there is no plans to release an update. There are many complaints like this on an XDA site run by enthusiasts but it seems O2 have turned their back on us. This model cost me a lot of money and was top of their range all year.
XDA still advrertising Blackberry support
Hi,
GOTO http://www.my-xda.com/xda2s_what.html and under 'Email & personal organiser' they are still advertising support for blackberry early 2005. Take a screen shot and email it to wathdog..!
seanrkelly said:
I have contacted BBC Watchdog (for those outside of UK - a consumer affairs watchdog that puts companies on the spot for mis-sold products) about the Blackberry update promised from O2 and how that ad for blackberry support has been removed with customer services saying there are no plans (despite what other people on this forum have said many times in the past) I would urge all other XDA IIs/i owners to do the same, if Watchdog get many of the same complaints - they will action it. We have to put O2 on the spot, enough is enough and it's time to bite back. This is what I sent:
I purchased an XDA IIi in February this year because O2 advertising said that a future rom update would allow me to pick up Blackberry emails. Since then and after many phone calls to their customers service departments, the new son the blackberry update has been withdrawn and customer services at O2 say there is no plans to release an update. There are many complaints like this on an XDA site run by enthusiasts but it seems O2 have turned their back on us. This model cost me a lot of money and was top of their range all year.
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Click to collapse
O2 are launching the new ROM next week, for S and I. Blackberry Connect is on it, and it works fine now - but it didn't at the start of the year.
Twit.
RE: BBC Watchdog - WM2005
Good idea. I have now contacted Watchdog about 02s' customer support regarding the WM2005 on the XDA IIi, please see the message I sent them below. I would suggest that any body else interested in the WM2005 upgrade for the Alpine, send a message to BBC Watchdog, I think this method would be more persuasive on 02 than the petition, although still useful.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/watchdog/index.shtml
Hi,
I am just contacting you regarding the appalling customer service from 02, the mobile phone provider.
They have been contacted by many many people about why they have sold their latest PDA/Phone the XDA IIi(Generic name 'HTC Alpine'), with all the latest processor hardware etc, but only installed the previous release of 'Windows Mobile 2003SE and not the current Microsoft Operating System 'Windows Mobile 2005'. Even though other manufacturers are offering backwood upgrades, in many cases 02 refuse to even contact you if you have made a email enquiry or some get a standard answer ie. "The hardware is not compatible", which of course is rubbish as Microsoft designed a test install of WM2005 for their staff on the previous 02 release the XDA II (Generic name 'Hymalaya). As is usual with the majority of customer helpdesks, they are only mouthpieces and have no way of offering any real or useful information to assist their customers in any meaningful way, although I'm sure the management mouthpieces would disagree!
These PDA/Phones cost alot of money and we as customers should not be ripped off by 02, they must do better, now please.
If you need some more for information go to this site http://forum.xda-developers.com/index.php , you will find plenty more people who are not happy. As you can see you'll get better support from this user run site than from the PDA companies!
Watchdog will not get involved with a WM2005 issue, O2 never promised it, never mentioned compatibility with future OS', and the main point being, don't even make the XDA devices, HTC do.
Alan I am an optimist and very much hope that if we complain enough, we can at least get some useful commincation out of O2 for a can. The XDA IIi has better hardware than many current WM5 devices. There's no reason why it can't run it so if we apply enough pressure, someone may listen.
This is why other manufacturers like Dell and HP remain an attractive and popular choice for users - they offer rom upgrade paths - they don't just dump their customers and move on like O2 have always done.
Alan, Do you work for 02? Sounds like it!
BBC Watchdog is not just about consumer law, it is about customers who feel they have been treated badly by cash grabbing companies who lack any real responsibilty towards their paying customers.
Have you not watched the program? Many companies have relented after customers have their problems aired on the program. We Alpine owners are not asking 02 anything unreasonable it is 02 who are being ignorant and evasive. :evil:
I have nothing to do with O2, I personally detest them, but you have to realise that the vast majority of XDA2i users would not be able to tell you what version of the OS it currently runs, let alone knowing there is the option of an upgrade to anything.
The people here are a very small minority of users who are the gadget lovers, geeks, and tech heads, O2, i-mate, qtek, T-Mobile, Orange, Vodafone, in fact, everyone that sells these things know they can ignore people like us because there are so few of us in comparison to the majority of customers who will blindly buy all the new versions without complaint.
Because *most* companies fail to offer any upgrade path, it becomes acceptable for none to offer it, so therefore, someone who knows nothing about these will argue we aren't being ripped off.
We know it's a raw deal, but this has been going on with WinCE devices for years now, and they never get any better, I very much doubt they will do now.
oh Alan!!!
your not a very excitable person are you...
No, not when it comes to things like this.
I have seen it happen too many times, a device is abandoned when it's this old usually.
The only way we will get 2005 is if a network releases it with 2005 and we copy it, or if a beta or development build is leaked as happened with the XDA2 or XDA2s.
There will be no official upgrade to 2005 for any of us because it would cost the company too much money to support. If it's leaked, and we trash our devices, the company doesn't have to worry about supporting it, and all the issues and questions about upgrading aren't their problem either.
Have I missed something here, what is so spectacularly superb about 2005? It will come with it's own set of bugs and incompatibilities.
Don't you people know anything about Microsoft yet?
I don't think BBC Watchdog would address this. This is because its a very specialised subject, something that won't bother 99.99% of the people who watch the program - they are there to address common issues which will affect many more people...
I think you'd have much more luck writing to the watchdog page of a specialist pocketpc magazine (don't know any off the top of my head) because it will affect a much larger percentage of their audience.
Well it is worth a try anyway. If Watchdog do a piece on bad support and high charges for mobiles etc, which I think is relevent to most users wether techy or not.they may include our bit as well.
I'll be looking at some mobile review sites and see if there are some high profile ones to address this issue too, at least \i'm trying, which is better than accepting the status quo.
Actually, I donly really mind not getting WM5 - it won't change how I use the device - but I do mind then ongoing issue with Blackberry Connect. Hopefully this will be sorted next week - but if past history is anything to go by, I'm not holding my breath!
O2 Blackberry upgrade?
So has O2 confirmed the new rom for next week then? There seems to be one person who says so...... any insiders? Tekguru?
seanrkelly said:
Actually, I donly really mind not getting WM5 - it won't change how I use the device - but I do mind then ongoing issue with Blackberry Connect. Hopefully this will be sorted next week - but if past history is anything to go by, I'm not holding my breath!
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I agree, not bothered particularily about WM5 as that was never advertised as one of the capabilities of the phone, Blackberry however was.
O2 should definately sort this out, Blackberry was one of the reasons for getting the phone, I've been waiting 6 months now despite being told by O2 that it was due in the spring , it's not good enough.
Slightly off topic but...
WM2005 would give you support for email push from MS Exchange servers, or from web companies providing the service, as opposed to specific Blackberry based systems.
This will seal the market on a corporate level for future roll outs as most companies will already have an Exchange server, and this will integrate well.
At the end of the day if you bought the device with word from the company that sold it to you telling you it would do something in the future that made you buy the device then withdrew this they are at fault. False advertising. As for watchdog not being interested, i'm sure theres many more things 02 and a whole host of other phone companies have and are doing wrong that merits them being put on the spot, problem is has watchdog got the balls to take on such giant organisations?
They've done it with much bigger companies, but the point is it won't satisfy a large enough number of viewers so in their eyes it won't be worth showing. Only a certain number of people are on O2, and a really tiny number choose the XDA2i, and only a small number of those are bothered by the issue in question. Whilst it's a very valid complaint, it doesn't make good TV.
No I agree. So maybe people ought to e-mail with all sorts of different complaints, that way they might dedicate more time for a section on rip off phone companies! At the end of the day you can't win, especially with phone companies, they screw you but just try not to get screwed up about it!
In a German PocketPC Forum a member reported that a German accessories supplier stopped the production because he had the sure message HTC had finished the KAISER production
( http://www.ppc-welt.info/community/showthread.php?t=124775 )
According to this message my actually experience in Germany is that a lot of important sellers cannot deliver the KAISER any more or set their delivery time on - indefinite time - !
...by the way: The German KAISER has a special feature: Keyboards have a QWERTZ-keyboard, not a QWERTY-keyboard as usual.
Dont know if this is relative, but i read somewhere 4got where..i think here, a rumour, that Kaisers in general have been put on production hold due to the fact that two driver software companies are in litigation (in courts) over a patent infringement.
i will try to find the link where i read this and post it
Great news...then HTC has time to sort out the stupid mistakes on this device.
Well look at the bright side.... atleast they are not planning to rip of new customer with the buggy video graphics... but if they are stopping production i doubt they are gonna be releasing any drivers for the Kaiser.... Boo Hoo
If this is about Qualcomm losing against Broadcom in the IP infringement fight, serves HTC right for picking Qualcomm for their core chipset.
It was probably this stupid decision that delayed the Kaiser release, made it expensive to develop it for performance, disallows tech support in the USA, and now it would starve sales because of chipset shortage. Hence, it's not really saving money versus going with an SiRFIII + Xscale or Samsung combination.
Woo, go Qualcomm!
Now can we get recompense for buying a turkey product that HTC can no longer support?
Doesn't that ruling ONLY apply to the US though? HTC sell their phones in a LOT more countries than just the US, so I doubt a US only ruling would affect the overall design of the devices like is being suggested.
As I understand TyTn II is exactly what the Polaris is Plus the keyboard. Now if the production of the TyTn is being stopped due to some litigation issue then how is it that the same does not apply to the Polaris
The post only states that a company that produces accessories for the Kaiser "said" that there will be no more. The statement was NOT made by HTC
perhaps the company supplying the accessories needs to sell of alot of stock and to create a run.... well it wouldnt be the first time hey...
Devicewire.co.uk stated that they are going to have Diamond in stock by June 9th. However this morning -->http://www.devicewire.co.uk/eshot/htc_touch_diamond_delivery/index.html
Apparently there is a rumor that HTC delayed delivery due to Quality issues. Anyone with more informations?
Much confusion atm - DeviceWire claiming to be first in the UK with them by 23rd June. Clove stating UK spec 16th, Hantech 19th. Expansys has already shipped but there are concerns that they may be Grey. TotalPDA have them in stock but are embargoed by HTC, no idea if they are grey or not....
Watch this sapce I think...
R
Play are still stating "Due for release on 13/06/2008", which I thought was the "offficial" launch date.
TotalPDA DONT have them in stock, the guy on the phone admited to me it was just to drum up interest. They're getting them on the 11th.
I was previously preordered on htcdirect.co.uk, so i was on the mailing list. They just sent out the following update. Why would HTC delay shipment because of software? Wierd.
Hi,
We have just been informed by the only official distributor of HTC products in the UK that the HTC Touch Diamond is now expected to come in on 17th June. The reason for the delay is a last minute software fix that needed to be applied. We appreciate that you have already been waiting a long time for this device, but it is better that known issues are dealt with at source rather then with a later ROM update or patch.
Please be aware that there are some grey-imports available in the UK. These are sourced from the Asian Market and thus come with warranty issues. HTC will not entertain warranty related repairs in the EU. Also, they only have a one year warranty. Also, they shipped without the software fix.
Be assured that your pre-order will be dealt with on the day the stock arrives.
Regards
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Devicewire claims that they will be the first in UK to have them, officially. They posted that the worst scenario is June 23rd. I don't understand this. Maybe a marketing trick to stop people ordering from Expansys? Fear of defective device can do wonders...
Still, I am hoping that shipment might be in UK before 23rd...I sent email to Devicewire, maybe they will give us some additional details.
Or perhaps there is actually an issue and it was only caught after the initial HK units were sold (and grey market sold in UK by Expansys). And perhaps that issue accounts for the lagginess differences between the demo videos by CoolSmartPhone and the actual units in people's hands...
there is a registry patch that apparently correct the lag problem.
drtwin said:
Devicewire.co.uk stated that they are going to have Diamond in stock by June 9th. However this morning -->http://www.devicewire.co.uk/eshot/htc_touch_diamond_delivery/index.html
Apparently there is a rumor that HTC delayed delivery due to Quality issues. Anyone with more informations?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same in Italy, HTC is making a rom update for european version.
This is reply I've got today by devicewire
___________________________________
Hi,
Thank you for contacting devicewire.com
We have been informed by HTC directly our shipment will leave the
weekend and will take about 10 days to arrive with us. I wouldn't be
surprised if items are dispatched ahead of the new advertised date.
If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Regards,
devicewire.com
I read somewhere that the new date is a 'worst case scenario', so the devices should start arriving shortly before then...
Anyway, the fact that HTC are willing to move the release date to apply a software fix shows, as you would expect with a flagship device, that they are taking this device seriously and that they really want it to work as well as we want it to work.
Dark Fire said:
I read somewhere that the new date is a 'worst case scenario', so the devices should start arriving shortly before then...
Anyway, the fact that HTC are willing to move the release date to apply a software fix shows, as you would expect with a flagship device, that they are taking this device seriously and that they really want it to work as well as we want it to work.
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Click to collapse
I hope so!
Its funny, i was just reading the other threads and tweaks etc, and how the phone doesnt wake up/vibrate etc when you get an SMS. In a past life when i was integrating GPRS kit at a network we used to have the handset group there to run handset tests against the network. I had quite a few discussions with them about phones and that kind of SMS 'flaw' is exactly the kid of software issue they would reject handsets on.
I wonder if it really is a HUGE software issue, or a bunch of minor ones that too many operators complained about.
Maybe someone should ask HTC excatly what software problems they're sorting out. Would there be any reason for them to keep a general description of the fixes secret?
Worth a shot, but i bet they wont want to say anything untill its released.
If its minor problems people will ***** - why hold up release just for that.
If its major problems people will ***** - if they let that slip past once, what else might they have missed.
The HTC Tilt is going EOL (end of life) by the middle of December from the AT&T lineup. The latest Windows Mobile 6.1 update was just recently released adding new life to the device and is available for current owners on the HTC support site. The sucessor to the Tilt has not been announced but is expected in Q4 of this year.
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http://www.pocketpcmag.com/cms/blog/6847/goodbye-mr-tilt
Wonder what's going to replace it?
bye bye to the Tilt but I think AT&T will either get SE X1, or Raphael. Tilt is an awsome phone. Hang.tauh's Rom is great...big thx to him.
jhego said:
http://www.pocketpcmag.com/cms/blog/6847/goodbye-mr-tilt
Wonder what's going to replace it?
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The Touch Pro being branded as the AT&T Fuze?
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/09/05/atandt-page-confirms-htc-touch-pro-as-fuze/
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/09/08/atandt-fuze-gets-fcc-approval/
so ive seen alot of people get att tilts when they did a warranty exchange from att 8525 because they didnt make them anymore..think thatl be the case this time? i sure would love for my tilt to have problems early next year when the touch pro is out and get a touch pro in return
i think the TILT has had a good run!
lately, i have come to the opinion that the TILT has had a really good run. as i can't find a branded Diamond or Touch Pro, its had almost a year of exclusivity, and with this community, it has been a truly enduring product. if it just had the drivers and a great camera.
but here is my question, i got this in early Oct, and I have had one exchange for a near-perfect refurb. that was in july. if this thing (externally) craps out in some way once the year manufacturers warranty is up, does this mean you HAVE to get insurance beyond the year if you want to be able to exchange (for upgrade if its all they have sure, but i am not entitled to that) once the warranty is up?
My problem with saying its had a good run is that even the next gen of HTC being released have very similar specs to the Kaiser. The only problem with it is the graphics drivers and HTC should get a swift kick in the balls for obviously EOL a device that for all intents and purposes is still a very good phone. If they would release the drivers for it I wouldnt be going to a goddamn android phone in 2 weeks. **** closed source I am all about writing my own drivers if I need them.
I don't think it is HTC that is EOL the device, AT&T is. With the new Fuze/Touch Pro/Raphael coming out sometime after October, it does not make business sense to continue to support the Tilt.
miketuri said:
...you HAVE to get insurance beyond the year if you want to be able to exchange (for upgrade if its all they have sure, but i am not entitled to that) once the warranty is up?
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I don't know of anywhere that you can purchase insurance for it. Do you?
(AT&T doesn't sell it. I tried to purchase from my homeowners...they would'n't do it).
I've replaced mine 4 times .
ewingr said:
I don't know of anywhere that you can purchase insurance for it. Do you?
(AT&T doesn't sell it. I tried to purchase from my homeowners...they would'n't do it).
I've replaced mine 4 times .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AT&T does offer insurance (here) for $4.99 a month. It wasn't offered on the Tilt when it first came out, but it is now.
The deductible is $50 for now, goes up to $125 after Nov. 2.
The insurance works well, in my experience. I'd only had the phone a couple of weeks when the dog ate it. No hassles, they had me a brand-new phone the next day.
There is a limit of two insurance claims per year.
i have the same option for insurance near me (NYC). i didn't mean of course that the phone was outdated. i won't have an early upgrade possibility until at least january, and i totally expect there to be the Pro-killer by March or latest June of 2009. my tilt will definitely hold up well in comparison over the next year.
overall though, as its exclusivity and sitting atop the WM market for a year, it has had a good run by those standards.
now give me my f-in drivers!
Morning peeps,
just a mention, i'm quite amazed with the lack of marketing for the HD7.
Just walked into a o2 shop to confirm if the HD7 is still on for 21st Oct and the answer was YES. But there no HD7 pics or notice on the o2 shop front.... why?
2 days left and no advertising...
It was exactly the same last year with the release of the HD2 and I imagine it happens all the time with new phones.
Last year they released the HD2 without marketing online or in any of the UK shops, but by lunchtime they had sold out their stocks. It was the same story over at Vodaphone UK.
Remember, you're probably not the only person to have walked into the shop and asked for the HD7 and I can imagine demand will be high for the first few weeks. After that HTC will probably have more units made.
xma1e said:
It was exactly the same last year with the release of the HD2 and I imagine it happens all the time with new phones.
Last year they released the HD2 without marketing online or in any of the UK shops, but by lunchtime they had sold out their stocks. It was the same story over at Vodaphone UK.
Remember, you're probably not the only person to have walked into the shop and asked for the HD7 and I can imagine demand will be high for the first few weeks. After that HTC will probably have more units made.
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Click to collapse
cool, but as i recall correctly, IPHONE 4 was marketed much better and well before its release. why not just copy it
I agree, Apple are good at that. MS doesn't have any real say over the OEMs and it is HTC supplying the devices to O2. HTC are also supplying several models on launch day, so I imagine they don't have all their factories making one model. AT the end pof the day we will never know.
Lets just hpe we don't have the hardware mess that was the iPhone antennae
So far here in the UK I haven't seen any advertising for Windows Phone 7. The only ads I've seen are ones I've found myself through reading about WP7 on sites like engadget and other tech news sites. If I was a member of Joe public, I'd have no clue it existed unless I'd actively been looking on Orange's website at phone upgrades.
Maybe I haven't been hanging around bus stops enough to see the advertising posters?
I agree I haven't seen anything either. I do recall knowing about the new iPhone 4 about a week before it was released, I think MS has missed the boat here.
The marketing of the features on this phone is truly a disappointment. My single favourite feature is the wireless sync. My brother always tells me hes jealous for that feature alone (he has an iphone 4). But most likely no one will hear about this and apple will introduce it in their next update and it will be the greatest thing that apple has done and all microsoft can do is sit there and say we had that first.