Database Develop

usb power?

why cant our phones operate without a battery and jus usb plugged in? at first i thought it wasnt enough power but i just tried to do a battery pull with the usb in and the phone is still on.
I attached a picture

Dri94 said:
why cant our phones operate without a battery and jus usb plugged in? at first i thought it wasnt enough power but i just tried to do a battery pull with the usb in and the phone is still on.
I attached a picture
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am totally missing something. You're asking why our phones wont work with only a charger plugged in or a usb > computer cord and no battery but then post a pic of your phone working in just that configuration. Sounds like you answered yourself to me.

Try to do it yourself, it wont work. I was running Faceniff and it froze, but my phone was still responsive. I could press the home button and all that and it work. When faceniff froze it let it work somehow.

Dri94 said:
Try to do it yourself, it wont work. I was running Faceniff and it froze, but my phone was still responsive. I could press the home button and all that and it work. When faceniff froze it let it work somehow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It could have to do with the fact that the battery is 3.7V and the charger/USB are 5V. The charger must be higher in order for it to work, but there are likely curcuits that need to run at a lower voltage (3.7V). Another reason might have to do with the fact that there are 4 terminals on the battery connector and when removed, makes a break in a circuit. This could possibly be overcome by jumpering some of the battery terminals, but you would probably want schematics before attempting this and I don't think Moto is going to give those out.

That all make sense. I just dont understand why my phone would still stay on because FaceNiff froze. I dont think i could repeat it but it was one of them rare things that made me wonder why this isn't just allowed by default if the phone is capable. I know that function would not have many uses but there are times when i had to order a new battery and wanted to use my phone but couldnt. this was manily jus curiosity thread to learn why this would work then anyting important aha

Dri94 said:
That all make sense. I just dont understand why my phone would still stay on because FaceNiff froze. I dont think i could repeat it but it was one of them rare things that made me wonder why this isn't just allowed by default if the phone is capable. I know that function would not have many uses but there are times when i had to order a new battery and wanted to use my phone but couldnt. this was manily jus curiosity thread to learn why this would work then anyting important aha
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand. When I mentioned the battery terminal jumper to complete the circuit, I was thinking about how you can start a manual transmission car with a dead battery just by pushing it and letting the clutch out. This turns the engine and the alternator which produces the electrical power needed to start. In theory this could work in a manual car without a battery at all, but now that I think about it you can't power this phone on even while plugged in until the battery reaches at least 5% charge. So I'm really thinking it requires the 3.7V to operate correctly.

Oh i see, that would show why it wouldnt start. Yay half that question is now answered aha. Now i just wonder why it still operated when the battery was pulled. but if you normally pull a batter, it doesnt still work.

Dri94 said:
Oh i see, that would show why it wouldnt start. Yay half that question is now answered aha. Now i just wonder why it still operated when the battery was pulled. but if you normally pull a batter, it doesnt still work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That lower voltage may only be required at startup, as in during boot up it does a self check to verify that voltage is present and than can continue to run at a higher voltage. In any circuit there has to be a voltage tolerance, so perhaps it is a software check that requires the 3.7V at startup.

It is possibly to run it without a battery installed, but not with the cable we're given. Team Black Hat sells developer cables that have something fancy going on which allows the phone to run without a battery installed.

mikedyk43 said:
That lower voltage may only be required at startup, as in during boot up it does a self check to verify that voltage is present and than can continue to run at a higher voltage. In any circuit there has to be a voltage tolerance, so perhaps it is a software check that requires the 3.7V at startup.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes but even if you do a battpull when already booted up the phone turns off...
To the poster above. Thats pretty cool. I neven knew that :] ima check out the diffrences between the cables. Good look.
Sent from my XT862 using Tapatalk

Dri94 said:
Yes but even if you do a battpull when already booted up the phone turns off...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
However, I believe that's a "firmware" off state, not a completely powered-off state, because a battery pull after a bad recovery flash won't work if the USB cable's still plugged in. Or at least it wouldn't for me. It looked like it was off, but was still sufficiently "on" that it didn't restore the boot loader when I put the battery back in and booted back up.
It took me three tries before I twigged to the problem, and I was starting to worry that I'd managed to brick it somehow.

just try it. the next person to comment. its not firmware off state, the phone goes completely off lol

[Q] Battery with question mark, unable to charge/boot/SBF

Hey all,
I got my Droid 4 a month ago and rooted it. It ran out of power while I was outside. When I tried charging it, a battery icon with a question mark comes up. I can't boot to Safestrap, and when I go to Fastboot, it says "Battery Low -- Cannot Program".
The phone doesn't turn on unless I plug it into the wall charger. If I plug it into the USB port on my laptop, the green LED comes on, but it won't turn on. I can boot to Android recovery, and I tried formatting /data and /cache, but that didn't help.
Funny thing: I can keep the phone in Android recovery, leave it plugged in, and it charges up enough to stay on for a while when I unplug it.
Now, I know about the Macgyver trick, and I'd like to give that a shot. iFixit has a fantastic teardown of the Droid 4, but unfortunately, removing the battery would very clearly void my warranty (although I guess having Safestrap voids that already), and I'm worried about doing permanent damage to my device. Are there any solutions besides "beg Verizon for a new phone"? Has anyone tried Macgyvering a Droid 4?

Curious, if you do BP Tools, does it drop you into Safestrap? I know mine does, and then maybe you can change some settings. Also, you could try to make a "Factory Cable". I know I made mine from my old OG Droid dock as it had the 5 wire jumper, and just jumped the 2 wires and it allowed me to flash w/o a charged battery.

I would ensure that the charger is putting out 5.1v and 850mA as my d4 won't charge or power on after the battery dies unless its with the factory charger or one that meets these specs
Sent from my DROID4 using XDA

Soulmech said:
Funny thing: I can keep the phone in Android recovery, leave it plugged in, and it charges up enough to stay on for a while when I unplug it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you tried leaving it plugged in for an extended period of time, say overnight, and see if it'll boot up?

gdeeble said:
Curious, if you do BP Tools, does it drop you into Safestrap? I know mine does, and then maybe you can change some settings. Also, you could try to make a "Factory Cable". I know I made mine from my old OG Droid dock as it had the 5 wire jumper, and just jumped the 2 wires and it allowed me to flash w/o a charged battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just tried BP Tools. It lets me drop into Safestrap, but Safestrap won't load due to the battery issue.
Hope you don't mind me asking, but what's a factory cable? Is it just a USB cable with the B end cut off, and the black and red wires stripped? My issue with jumping the device/battery is that I'm unable (or supposed to be unable) to remove the battery, so any solution along those lines would have to allow me to keep the battery in place. Otherwise, my warranty is voided.
I know root voids it, but I'd have a better chance of sneaking that by than an obviously-moved battery.
dbreezy187 said:
I would ensure that the charger is putting out 5.1v and 850mA as my d4 won't charge or power on after the battery dies unless its with the factory charger or one that meets these specs
Sent from my DROID4 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm using the charger that came with the phone. It says 5.1V/850mA on the side.

bdbraaten said:
Have you tried leaving it plugged in for an extended period of time, say overnight, and see if it'll boot up?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tried it last night. Left it in recovery for a good 8 hours or so. No dice.

Did you try opening it, then removing the battery? If you pull up too hard with out a removal tool, the glue is strong enough to allow the battery to bend and break internally, causing this error. Might check if another battery works, there are some available online if you search.

nequeelrey said:
Did you try opening it, then removing the battery? If you pull up too hard with out a removal tool, the glue is strong enough to allow the battery to bend and break internally, causing this error. Might check if another battery works, there are some available online if you search.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Isn't the reason the battery is non-removable because the type of battery chemistry used can explode of that type of damage occurs? Or do they just hate us?
Has anybody ever been turned down for warranty work that is hardware related, even if they are rooted, etc? I've never heard of it happening...
If OP get a dud battery, s/he should just get it replaced by Moto. They shouldn't have to try to replace it themselves.

Try the instructions from this thread and let us know if it works...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=23678683&postcount=1

The OP said they tried the BP Tools method but it is disabled due to Safe strap using that as the trigger for its bootstrapped recovery.
Using a factory cable would allow you to boot the phone and either flash the stock firmware or uninstall Safe strap and let you charge the phone while in BP Tools mode.
That is the only safe a certain way to recover the device. Hot wiring the battery with a USB cable cannot be considered safe, but will work if you want to fix it yourself without a factory cable.
Using a factory cable to flash the full XML.zip with RSD Lite is the first thing a technician would do to restore it if it was returned under warranty anyway, after checking for physical damage of course.

I've got a few factory cables laying around and would be more than happy to send you one, let me know. Just cover the postage and you'll be flashing in no time.

So to update: I have an insurance policy with Global Warranty Group, and I filed a claim with them, which got me a new device (instead of a refurb). So, I suppose the issue is moot.
Rick#2 said:
I've got a few factory cables laying around and would be more than happy to send you one, let me know. Just cover the postage and you'll be flashing in no time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would be grateful if you could send me one. I will PM you to figure out details on paying you for postage.

The same thing is happening to me and I have Droid X, any help?

Will BP work after removing safestrap from the advanced menu? If so I think you could use that link to charge from BP.
Sent from my DROID4 using xda premium

usb cable splice works
Just chiming in here to confirm a spliced usb cable will charge an xt894 battery. my situation was pretty much an xt894 with a wiped system (therefore, unable to charge) and not enough battery to fastboot. if I plugged it into a charger or a 5v usb slot from my computer just a green led would show on the front, but no charge. I removed my battery, cut a usb cable in half, and hooked up the wires to the coresponding terminals on the battery (which are clearly marked) and it charged up just fine and I was able to fastboot.
Not the prettiest solution, but it really helped me out when I absolutely needed to charge in order to fastboot, although it will void your warranty if that's important to you.
I currently have a problem where the question mark shows in the battery while charging and I'm unable to boot into OS or safestrap. I'm not at home right now, but I have an extra battery that I'll pop in later to see if that changes anything, or has enough juice to fastboot.

This morning my wife woke up to no battery charge, because I stole her charger in the night. But she has the question mark even though the phone was working fine last night! I wonder, considering I left the USB cord plugged in on the D4 end when I took the charger (to use my cord) could I have screwed something up? She's going to leave it in the OEM charger all day at work, but the quesiton mark worries me.
My question is, if I do the cut cord trick to manually charge the battery at the terminals, does that help recover it so that it can be charged via regular means? Or is it just a way to get the data off the phone? Phone is stock 4.1 with root.

[Q] Droid 3 bricked

My droid 3 will not boot, if I plug it in to my computer, it will not turn on and it will show no screen, it all happened after I restored my phone on a low battery. It is missing certain files like the bootloader so i can't restore the rom on the phone. What should I do?

trevorjanssen12 said:
My droid 3 will not boot, if I plug it in to my computer, it will not turn on and it will show no screen, it all happened after I restored my phone on a low battery. It is missing certain files like the bootloader so i can't restore the rom on the phone. What should I do?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it needs to charge. Plug it into a wall socket.

Well I need to get the phone back up and running and the bootloader as well as the charging program is missing. I have a brand new battery for it. It is fully charged.

I got the phone up and running

trevorjanssen12 said:
I got the phone up and running
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So what was the problem

jithudigitised said:
So what was the problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem was when I originally tried to flash it... it failed due to dead battery... WORST MISTAKE EVER... so I purchased a fastboot cable and tried to get the phone up and running but it was mounting the device in windows as OMAP4430 so I tried again last month and I got it back up and running with the latest version of android... the one that came with the device.

I AM SO ANGRY AT THIS PHONE.. IT WILL NOT EVEN BOOT IN TO ANDROID!

trevorjanssen12 said:
The problem was when I originally tried to flash it... it failed due to dead battery... WORST MISTAKE EVER... so I purchased a fastboot cable and tried to get the phone up and running but it was mounting the device in windows as OMAP4430 so I tried again last month and I got it back up and running with the latest version of android... the one that came with the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm having a similar issue with trying to fix a friend's phone that only displays the "Dual Core" logo when plugged into the computer. The computer itself doesn't appear to register that the phone is connected so doesn't show up in device manager that I can see. Plugging into a wall outlet doesn't light the device screen up, only the computer (Win7 box). I believe he dunked the bootloader, and it's bricked, but I'm trying to fix it anyway. Anyone reading this, I would appreciate any useful pointers or suggestions. Thanks all.

bwpoersch said:
I'm having a similar issue with trying to fix a friend's phone that only displays the "Dual Core" logo when plugged into the computer. The computer itself doesn't appear to register that the phone is connected so doesn't show up in device manager that I can see. Plugging into a wall outlet doesn't light the device screen up, only the computer (Win7 box). I believe he dunked the bootloader, and it's bricked, but I'm trying to fix it anyway. Anyone reading this, I would appreciate any useful pointers or suggestions. Thanks all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
battery maybe dead, if software is corrupt/soft bricked, phone will not charge battery
get a Motorola Factory Cable Adaptor by Team Black Hat or Battery Desktop Charger for Motorola Droid 3 XT862

sd_shadow said:
battery maybe dead, if software is corrupt/soft bricked, phone will not charge battery
get a Motorola Factory Cable Adaptor by Team Black Hat or Battery Desktop Charger for Motorola Droid 3 XT862
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That occurred to me as well, I'm going to first see if the local Verizon store can charge it (or even replace it) for free. My friend actually did manage to score a power cable, but I'm not convinced yet that that is what I need (since I'm getting nowhere with it). I'd like to eliminate the battery as an issue if possible first before spending any money.

bwpoersch said:
That occurred to me as well, I'm going to first see if the local Verizon store can charge it (or even replace it) for free. My friend actually did manage to score a power cable, but I'm not convinced yet that that is what I need (since I'm getting nowhere with it). I'd like to eliminate the battery as an issue if possible first before spending any money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Verizon will not replace battery for free, if phone is more than 1 year old
The software that charges the battery is very easily corrupted, can be reflashed with firmware, but need a charged battery.
The TBH factory cable adaptor will power the phone direct from usb port, no battery is even needed, then firmware can be flashed and charging will work again.

sd_shadow said:
Verizon will not replace battery for free, if phone is more than 1 year old
The software that charges the battery is very easily corrupted, can be reflashed with firmware, but need a charged battery.
The TBH factory cable adaptor will power the phone direct from usb port, no battery is even needed, then firmware can be flashed and charging will work again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've actually gotten a battery in the past for an obsolete phone, but out of packaging and possibly used. My friend acquired a power cable (not sure from where) which just lights the screen as described above (with or without battery installed), but turns off as soon as I unplug it, so I have my suspicions about the usability of his cable. I struck out with the local Verizon store, so will just order the wall charger and charge the battery next. Crossing fingers... Thanks for supplying that link tho, that's the one I will use.

Follow-up: It took 3 weeks to receive that battery charger from Singapore of all places, but it worked. I didn't charge it up all the way, maybe just to 50%. The phone with battery immediately was able to boot into fastboot. Using rsdlite and motohelper installed, I had the phone back to fully functional within 15 minutes.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

Great, thanks for the update.
---------- Post added at 08:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:17 AM ----------
One thing you should check.
Is the battery bulged on one or both sides?
If you lay on a table, does it spin like a top?
If so battery should be replaced.

sd_shadow said:
Great, thanks for the update.
---------- Post added at 08:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:17 AM ----------
One thing you should check.
Is the battery bulged on one or both sides?
If you lay on a table, does it spin like a top?
If so battery should be replaced.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, the battery was/is fine (in fact, fully charged afterwards it lasted 2 days on standby). I think my friend probably was just trying to flash a new ROM and didn't notice he had such a low charge. Still not sure why the cable he bought didn't provide the necessary charge to recover, but that's what you get sometimes with aftermarket equipment I guess. Still, it's good to know that is a possible solution for someone else down the road.

sd_shadow said:
battery maybe dead, if software is corrupt/soft bricked, phone will not charge battery
get a Motorola Factory Cable Adaptor by Team Black Hat or Battery Desktop Charger for Motorola Droid 3 XT862
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already have this and I did not get it working so I got a DROID 4

[Q] Mighty AtrixHD/MB886 killed by digitizer & battery replacement?

Hey all,
Before I even start here, please no snide replies about using the search box on here or anywhere... if the answer is out there, I'm at a loss for the keywords to get it. Fair enough? As FYI, bootloader is (was??) unlocked, rooted, and has cwm recovery.
So I dropped my MB886 cracking the screen (round of applause please) and in the process of disassembling the case to install replacement I tore (severed) the battery connection cable. Fast forward to phone now reassembled with new screen and battery installed --> -->
The phone now has a green LED that will respond with blinks to button certain presses i.e. the simulated battery pull, but the device doesn't show up in lsusb output or device manager. I've read of similar problems where the phone has been brought back, and I've read of the exact problem with no solution. Basically the only two things I've really read that supposedly work are battery pull button sequence and using OEM charger/cable to get battery to take a charge.
Unlike, say the Atrix 2 where the lonely white LED is there to serve as a reminder that it is a hard brick and that's all you're ever going to get from it again, I haven't even read that this is in fact the #1 sign device is now a brick. So could someone verify it is or isn't? I've never tried to access a device this way, but Is JTAG an option?
I don't get why this should be, despite battery issue, it's all simple hardware swapping involved here as the software wasn't touched and was 100% working even with cracked screen.
Thanks for anyone with an answer or the direction to one.

2 things it could be then: you over- or under-tightened the new battery cable screws to where there isn't a good connection with the board. The screws have to provide equal pressure on the positive or negative contacts or otherwise there's a fault in the circuit.
OR
Your new LCD/digitizer is defective OR wasn't seated well.
Since it was working before, and since you didn't break anything else (to your knowledge), those are the two things I would check.

Dr. Orange said:
2 things it could be then: you over- or under-tightened the new battery cable screws to where there isn't a good connection with the board. The screws have to provide equal pressure on the positive or negative contacts or otherwise there's a fault in the circuit.
OR
Your new LCD/digitizer is defective OR wasn't seated well.
Since it was working before, and since you didn't break anything else (to your knowledge), those are the two things I would check.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
--
hey, thanks for the input. I remember battery connections being snugged when I originally took it apart, and to be honest, short of having a mini torque wrench I don't know I could put them back any closer to that. the digitizer could certainly be either defective or perhaps have a bad connection, and i am certainly willing to test/check for either, however do you know that this would prevent the phone from booting or cause it to only display the green led as a sign of life? something of the "halt on all errors" in pc bios? seems logical that the led would (or could've) been used like the oc speaker and blink out some code relaying you've got a bad O2 sensor or the gas cap isn't tight.

Over tightening can cause problems. So loosen them a bit if it's just-short-of torque wrench tight. I don't know why it does, but I've read people had problems when they over tightened those screws. That green light could be telling you that the battery is connected poorly.

Is there a possibility that the battery is so depleted that it won't charge? For that, you need a factory cable to charge the battery with power off.

Sorry, to clarify, no I just snugged the battery connections when reassembling, I only meant that i don't think i could get them any closer to the way they were originally without aid of something like a torque wrench.
As for battery charge as a potential issue... to be fair, I only have a OEM Moto wall charger and I think the cable I am using is Samsung. Surely the cable itself isn't the weak link in this chain? A car battery on a multimeter reading 12.0 volts is something like 50% charged and about 12.8 volts is looking pretty good, anyone know what I should get out of the 3.8V Li-Ion on a meter?
PS I double checked the both data cable connections to the motherboard, so I doubt just a bad connection is to blame here.

slerros-1.0 said:
Sorry, to clarify, no I just snugged the battery connections when reassembling, I only meant that i don't think i could get them any closer to the way they were originally without aid of something like a torque wrench.
As for battery charge as a potential issue... to be fair, I only have a OEM Moto wall charger and I think the cable I am using is Samsung. Surely the cable itself isn't the weak link in this chain? A car battery on a multimeter reading 12.0 volts is something like 50% charged and about 12.8 volts is looking pretty good, anyone know what I should get out of the 3.8V Li-Ion on a meter?
PS I double checked the both data cable connections to the motherboard, so I doubt just a bad connection is to blame here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should get from 3.8 to 4.1.

slerros-1.0 said:
As for battery charge as a potential issue... to be fair, I only have a OEM Moto wall charger and I think the cable I am using is Samsung. Surely the cable itself isn't the weak link in this chain?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When I say "factory" cable, I'm not talking about the cable that came with the phone. There is a special Motorola cable (that you can even make yourself) that can charge your phone in situations when your phone is normally not willing to accept a charge.
If all else fails, try this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1077414

Yes! This is brilliant and certainly answers a few questions. It'll take me a bit to get this together to try it, but I'll post back when I get a result. Cheers!

slerros-1.0 said:
Yes! This is brilliant and certainly answers a few questions. It'll take me a bit to get this together to try it, but I'll post back when I get a result. Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Scratch my previous answer. Seems I misunderstood what a "factory cable" is for. It can't actually charge your battery, instead it is used to power the phone so that you can flash/diagnose it, even when your battery is dead. Normally, you need a working phone to charge the battery (with the stock "charging cable").
This information may or may not help you. At the very least, using a "factory cable" may allow you to power your phone on, which would tell you whether the problem is your battery or the phone.

quasihellfish said:
Scratch my previous answer. Seems I misunderstood what a "factory cable" is for. It can't actually charge your battery, instead it is used to power the phone so that you can flash/diagnose it, even when your battery is dead. Normally, you need a working phone to charge the battery (with the stock "charging cable").
This information may or may not help you. At the very least, using a "factory cable" may allow you to power your phone on, which would tell you whether the problem is your battery or the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, i'll take it regardless... i've acquired one of these mythical factory cables and it gets me into fastboot and recovery, so i'd wager, even though i haven't seen it, that it would boot all the way. so being that i don't have either the original charger (although have one that's motorola) or cable (samsung), my best bet is probably just find a store that has both an OEM motorola charger and cable even if they're not for the MB886? surely one for a moto x would work to charge battery, no?
or is this like a chicken and egg problem i now have? a catch 22? i can't charge the battery without a working phone, and i can't have a working phone without a charged battery? golly gee, anybody out there with an MB886 want to charge my battery for me? can i just hotwire the battery to a couple of leads from a charger and bypass using the phone as the charging device? at least to give the battery say 15%-20% to get something to happen... like get this rain cloud perpetually parked above me to blow over from above my head for a day or two maybe?
so, with phone plugged in with "factory cable" here's what i get and when... the phone bootloops on the "bootloader unlocked" warning screen if i don't press anything. volume down gets me fastboot, volume up gets me recovery. phone shows up in both and takes commands... so is it possible i just need to restore a nandroid backup, or is the battery charge the better bet now? i would just try the nandroid for $h!ts and giggles, but the last one i have isn't as fresh as i'd like, but is certainly usable if i must.

slerros-1.0 said:
well, i'll take it regardless... i've acquired one of these mythical factory cables and it gets me into fastboot and recovery, so i'd wager, even though i haven't seen it, that it would boot all the way. so being that i don't have either the original charger (although have one that's motorola) or cable (samsung), my best bet is probably just find a store that has both an OEM motorola charger and cable even if they're not for the MB886? surely one for a moto x would work to charge battery, no?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any generic USB charging cable SHOULD be good enough to charge and flash your phone, especially a Motorola cable. I'm currently using an old Blackberry cable for everything. They should be all the same. In rare instances, a cheap cable may give you issues (I think I had a cable from an old Samsung phone that I couldn't get to work right).
I guess just keep trying until you find one that works. Hate to tell you to go spend $20+ on an official Motorola charger...
Regarding your battery, yes you may be in a bit of a pickle. I've never had to do it, but I've read of users who had to short some leads in order to directly charge the battery. Trying searching through the forums, I'm sure the info is here.
---------- Post added at 02:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:55 PM ----------
slerros-1.0 said:
or is this like a chicken and egg problem i now have? a catch 22? i can't charge the battery without a working phone, and i can't have a working phone without a charged battery? golly gee, anybody out there with an MB886 want to charge my battery for me? can i just hotwire the battery to a couple of leads from a charger and bypass using the phone as the charging device? at least to give the battery say 15%-20% to get something to happen... like get this rain cloud perpetually parked above me to blow over from above my head for a day or two maybe?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=892026

All hope is lost, I am now looking for a replacement.
Ok, so here's where I am at with this now... As we're basically talking about any regulated power supply that can put out an excess of (around) 3.8V and 800mA I've opted to use an old ATX computer power supply and wired the mini B USB end of a cable known to have in fact to have charged this very phone... nothing. I have also, for sake of hope, even tried using the wall wort from an iPad (which puts out a cool 5.1V and up to 2.1A). The green LED will shut off after a while of being plugged into said charger, but still no booty action.
As stated before, the phone still works with the factory cable.
So, I gather from this that...
A. some hardware component (i.e. resistor, etc...) on my phones board that is involved in the charging process has gone kaput.
or
B. There is some software flag flipped somewhere that could be unflipped with or without some trickery to what actually is VS what I want the phone to think it's seeing.
Anyone have any thoughts on this or something similar pertaining to B as a course of action?
*update to my update* ... umm, which should now be up to date??
I did a complete wipe of the phone (/system, /data, /data/media, /cache, and /dalvik-cache) and reinstalled the rom... and still nothing.

Issue: Wireless Charging Boots up Phone

I was searching around for anyone else with this issue and can't find anyone.
I shut down my N6 and place it on my LG wireless charger, then the phone boots up automatically.
I've also tried shutting it down while already on the wireless charger, and the phone still boots up.
I've been able to replicate this on the Nexus Charging Orb.
Does anyone know if there is a solution to allow the phone to remain off?
Thanks in advance!

bump for help

I am pretty sure that for qi to work it has to be powered on.
Sent from my SM-T320 using XDA Free mobile app

What you are experiencing is a Motorola thing. I believe the Droid Turbo does the same (my buddy had it and said it so don't quote me on it). It is not a feature of Qi as both my S4 and Note 3 will charge via Qi and not boot the phone. It actually even has a different graphic for charging even.
Sent from my SM-N900A using Tapatalk

jev3gs said:
What you are experiencing is a Motorola thing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope they fix this with an future update. I don't see any benefit of having this occur

after researching this, the poster above is correct. this is a motorola feature/issue. my nexus 5 charges while off without a problem. NO idea who at moto thought this would be a good idea. it sucks actually. sadly, there is no solution that i've found

Robert_W said:
I was searching around for anyone else with this issue and can't find anyone.
I shut down my N6 and place it on my LG wireless charger, then the phone boots up automatically.
I've also tried shutting it down while already on the wireless charger, and the phone still boots up.
I've been able to replicate this on the Nexus Charging Orb.
Does anyone know if there is a solution to allow the phone to remain off?
Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ive​
I've been having the same problem , I have the N4 (LG) orb and the nexus 6. tried all night to get it to charge while the power was off. I still haven't fond any solution to this hopefull thy fix with update because this is a stupid feature.

I can confirm the issue.

Since the battery life on this phone is pretty good I don't often use the wireless charger during the day anymore. However I prefer to use the USB port as little as possible so I'd like to charge up over night with the wireless charger. And since I prefer my phone off overnight this issue has really been deterring me from using the wireless chargers at all.
I also hope this will is software thing so that an update may fix it.

Robert_W said:
I hope they fix this with an future update. I don't see any benefit of having this occur
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unlikely. If the phone is off and connecting to Qi turns it on, it means it is managed by firmware, not android / recovery / bootloader etc.. Unlikely you'll see a hardware firmware update ever

rootSU said:
Unlikely. If the phone is off and connecting to Qi turns it on, it means it is managed by firmware, not android / recovery / bootloader etc.. Unlikely you'll see a hardware firmware update ever
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is not entirely correct. This is why;
ALL charging, whether it be a dumb power wire, qualcomm quick charge, regular old usb port, or Qi...... requires that the phone actually be ON to control the charging.
Usually, the mode that it is in *looks* like it is off. This is a special boot mode that is specific for charging. It brings the kernel up, and not a whole lot else. If you tap the power button, it'll show you a charging image and the percentage.
What this means is that when it gets to a Qi charger, it actually turns on with a normal boot (or at least *closer* to normal), rather than booting into charging mode.
Now in the kernel commandline, there are a few parameters that get passed in by the bootloader to indicate power up reasons and so forth, so if somebody wouldn't mind..... you can dump the kernel commandline by running 'cat /proc/cmdline' as root. I would like to see that line in all the different boot modes; normal boot, recovery boot, qi charging boot, quickcharge boot, normalcharge boot. You can, of course, edit out your serial numbers and mac addresses. I don't HAVE a qi charger, so I can't get that.

doitright said:
That is not entirely correct. This is why;
ALL charging, whether it be a dumb power wire, qualcomm quick charge, regular old usb port, or Qi...... requires that the phone actually be ON to control the charging.
Usually, the mode that it is in *looks* like it is off. This is a special boot mode that is specific for charging. It brings the kernel up, and not a whole lot else. If you tap the power button, it'll show you a charging image and the percentage.
What this means is that when it gets to a Qi charger, it actually turns on with a normal boot (or at least *closer* to normal), rather than booting into charging mode.
Now in the kernel commandline, there are a few parameters that get passed in by the bootloader to indicate power up reasons and so forth, so if somebody wouldn't mind..... you can dump the kernel commandline by running 'cat /proc/cmdline' as root. I would like to see that line in all the different boot modes; normal boot, recovery boot, qi charging boot, quickcharge boot, normalcharge boot. You can, of course, edit out your serial numbers and mac addresses. I don't HAVE a qi charger, so I can't get that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is different. When the phone is off and you plug a cable in, it boots to a charging mode, which sometimes uses a Micro kernel in the bootloader or sometimes the main android kernel - depending on the device. This is triggered by receiving current through the USB port. Obviously bootloader and kernel can be updated by ota.
However, the above is not what the OP is describing. He says the phone boots up. The Qi is triggering the phone to boot up and its not booting into this charging mode. What this says to me is that a hardware trigger based on qi connection is triggering firmware to force a boot, rather than the kernel

rootSU said:
This is different. When the phone is off and you plug a cable in, it boots to a charging mode, which sometimes uses a Micro kernel in the bootloader or sometimes the main android kernel - depending on the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
QUALCOMM devices all boot the main kernel.
This is triggered by receiving current through the USB port. Obviously bootloader and kernel can be updated by ota.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or, obviously, also through the Qi charging coil and/or magnetic switch.
However, the above is not what the OP is describing. He says the phone boots up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RIGHT!!!
Which it ALSO does if you plug in the USB wire. It just boots to a different MODE.
The Qi is triggering the phone to boot up and its not booting into this charging mode. What this says to me is that a hardware trigger based on qi connection is triggering firmware to force a boot, rather than the kernel
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You might want to re-read my last message in this thread involving things like the REASON for a boot up. The boot REASON is passed to the kernel by the bootloader on the kernel commandline. If the Qi is generating a special boot reason (like the USB does), then it is pretty simple to add a catch for that boot reason into the init and take it into CHARGING mode instead of a full Android boot. For example; find the line that effectively reads as "if (bootreason == usbcharge) start_chargemode();" and change it to "if (bootreason == usbcharge || bootreason == qicharge) start_chargemode();"
It is also possible that the boot reason for usb charge and qi charge are actually the same, but that the distinction is made DURING init. I.e., "if (bootreason == charge && charger != qi) start_chargemode()".
Starting to understand?

Thing is, you will likely not get a solution for the simple reason that it doesn't make sense to turn a device off for charging these days, may be your preference, but if you want something like this you will need to do it yourself, there's no real need for something like this for a regular dev to invest the time on it

doitright said:
Starting to understand?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Starting to realise how condescending you are. Not really interested in anything you have to say to be honest. Bye.

z0phi3l said:
Thing is, you will likely not get a solution for the simple reason that it doesn't make sense to turn a device off for charging these days, may be your preference, but if you want something like this you will need to do it yourself, there's no real need for something like this for a regular dev to invest the time on it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that's your opinion, and in my opinion it's wrong. there's no need to have my phone on when i sleep, and devices charge faster when off. also, my two other Qi devices, Nexus 5 and Nexus 7, charge wirelessly when off JUST FINE. so it's not unreasonable to expect N6 to behave the same way

rootSU said:
Starting to realise how condescending you are. Not really interested in anything you have to say to be honest. Bye.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How about this; next time you READ and TRY TO UNDERSTAND before just assuming that everybody besides you is an idiot, then maybe you won't be treated like YOU are the idiot.
---------- Post added at 06:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:21 PM ----------
indianajonze said:
that's your opinion, and in my opinion it's wrong. there's no need to have my phone on when i sleep, and devices charge faster when off. also, my two other Qi devices, Nexus 5 and Nexus 7, charge wirelessly when off JUST FINE. so it's not unreasonable to expect N6 to behave the same way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except that.... it is physically impossible for the device to charge when it is entirely off. The PMIC must be turned on, and for that to be on, the SoC must also, which means that the kernel must boot up. The only question is what mode it boots up into.
Fact is that if you boot into full android and turn on AIRPLANE MODE, it won't use any more power than it uses in CHARGER MODE, and it won't interrupt you -- it is *effectively* turned off.
And actually, here is an interesting piece of information for you to learn....
If you boot it to full Android, put the thing in airplane mode, unplug it, and turn the screen off... that will actually yield a lower power consumption from the device than what will happen when it is plugged in and booted to CHARGER mode. The reason is because in charger mode, it ALWAYS keeps one CPU core turned on! When it is unplugged, the charger's kernel wakelock is released, allowing ALL cores to shut down.

doitright said:
How about this; next time you READ and TRY TO UNDERSTAND before just assuming that everybody besides you is an idiot, then maybe you won't be treated like YOU are the idiot
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Counter offer... Because I never assumed anyone was an idiot and actually since you haven't said anything I didn't know (you just assumed I didn't know anything.) Perhaps YOU should take your own advice before dishing out dumbed down and (although technically correct) incomplete "explanations" in a frankly condescending manor.
You didn't even try to get your head around what I was trying to say before going on the offensive.
I've been a desktop engineer for many years. I understand how hardware triggers the bootloader to hand over to the kernel. Now here I did make an assumption that firmware was involved. That's because I based it on something not dissimilar in my world. Wake on LAN. Now I fully admit that my understanding might be outmoded as its a different technology but you completely omit the fact that firmware layer says between the hardware and the bootloader or kernel. I have already said that I am not sure if the charging mode is a bootloader micro kernel or the android kernel. Different devices work differently here and I don't know which method it uses.
That said, my assumption is that like wake-on-LAN, the hardware firmware controls what is sent to the bootloader or kernel as an instruction. If that's true, no way would Google "fix" that with an OTA as why would they bother making it do that in the first place. Sure, that isn't to say it isn't doable and I never said it wasn't. Just that it would be unlikely to be "fixed"as it is by design.

doitright said:
How about this; next time you READ and TRY TO UNDERSTAND before just assuming that everybody besides you is an idiot, then maybe you won't be treated like YOU are the idiot.
---------- Post added at 06:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:21 PM ----------
Except that.... it is physically impossible for the device to charge when it is entirely off. The PMIC must be turned on, and for that to be on, the SoC must also, which means that the kernel must boot up. The only question is what mode it boots up into.
Fact is that if you boot into full android and turn on AIRPLANE MODE, it won't use any more power than it uses in CHARGER MODE, and it won't interrupt you -- it is *effectively* turned off.
And actually, here is an interesting piece of information for you to learn....
If you boot it to full Android, put the thing in airplane mode, unplug it, and turn the screen off... that will actually yield a lower power consumption from the device than what will happen when it is plugged in and booted to CHARGER mode. The reason is because in charger mode, it ALWAYS keeps one CPU core turned on! When it is unplugged, the charger's kernel wakelock is released, allowing ALL cores to shut down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you're missing the point. there are ways around all of it, including airplane mode, dnd modes if you have lollipop or CM, but these are still more steps than simply turning the phone off. i just want it off. fewer steps = better, and when its off there is zero chance that i forget to turn on one of these modes and be awakened at 3am by some nonsense facebook post. as mentioned earlier, other devices will charge wirelessly while off, so the issue is clearly with the nexus 6.
not sure why you're trying to make excuses here. get a nexus 5 or 7 and then tell me N6 is operating correctly. Those devices will charge while off (however you choose to define that). Whether you approve or not of the way N6 does things is irrelevant to me, but for myself and many others it is a broken situation

rootSU said:
Counter offer... Because I never assumed anyone was an idiot and actually since you haven't said anything I didn't know (you just assumed I didn't know anything.) Perhaps YOU should take your own advice before dishing out dumbed down and (although technically correct) incomplete "explanations" in a frankly condescending manor.
You didn't even try to get your head around what I was trying to say before going on the offensive.
I've been a desktop engineer for many years. I understand how hardware triggers the bootloader to hand over to the kernel. Now here I did make an assumption that firmware was involved. That's because I based it on something not dissimilar in my world. Wake on LAN. Now I fully admit that my understanding might be outmoded as its a different technology but you completely omit the fact that firmware layer says between the hardware and the bootloader or kernel. I have already said that I am not sure if the charging mode is a bootloader micro kernel or the android kernel. Different devices work differently here and I don't know which method it uses.
That said, my assumption is that like wake-on-LAN, the hardware firmware controls what is sent to the bootloader or kernel as an instruction. If that's true, no way would Google "fix" that with an OTA as why would they bother making it do that in the first place. Sure, that isn't to say it isn't doable and I never said it wasn't. Just that it would be unlikely to be "fixed"as it is by design.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lets start over. Ok?
Everything involving the device turning on involves hardware and firmware. You are not being unreasonable in assuming some similarity to WOL. The main difference here is that we actually have more information available regarding the CAUSE of the wake-up. Where the WOL packet gets sent once and its over, a Qi charger *continues* to be connected and supplying power. In addition, the bootloaders on the phone actually provide more information to the kernel than you can get on a desktop/server machine.
At the most basic level, something physical happens that triggers a power up, whether that be a magnetic field received through the Qi coil, a DC current applied to the USB port, or the power button being pressed and sending a current through the 'on' pin of the PMIC.
From there, it begins executing bootloaders in the order PBL --> SBL1 --> SBL2 --> TZ --> back to SBL2 --> SBL3 --> ABOOT.
ABOOT, which carries a LittleKernel "LK" payload, is a multi-bootloader with THREE boot modes; fastboot (part of LK) selected if LK detects VOL- being pressed, boot (standard boot, linux kernel from boot partition) selected if LK detects NO Vol button being pressed, recovery (linux kernel from recovery partition) selected if LK detects VOL+ being pressed. In addition to loading and starting the linux kernel on recovery or boot partition, it sets a number of kernel parameters, indicating various other details, such as, like we've talked about, a charging reason flag.
What I *do not* know, is what the different sets of parameters look like comparing USB charging, Qi charging, and Power button.
Not that we really even NEED to know, since there are other hacks we can use to choose a boot mode.
I.e., the kernel knows when the Qi charger is connected. If there is no difference at all between the flags set by a power-button startup and a Qi charger startup, then we need only check if (a) there is a Qi charger connected during the init, and (b) that the boot reason is NOT "reboot", and use that information to decide to boot into charging mode. Let me explain the not-reboot part: If the phone is placed on the Qi pad from a power off state, it will power on right away with a reason that is not reboot. The user would not even have a chance to press the power button to turn it on, which means that the combination of "normal" boot with the presence of a Qi charger, means that it MUST be a qi-boot. If they then press the power button from charging mode to "turn it on", it will actually BE a reboot, so we can take that to mean to go into a normal boot.
I do agree, fully, that Google/Moto will NOT be changing this behavior in an OTA, since it is clearly "working as intended".... HOWEVER, this *is* a Nexus, and the best part about having a Nexus is that you can hack it to suit yourself. As a result, the discussion on how to change this behavior is still quite valid.